SS or LS for the 200m

[Megaplaya]

Ok, so here is a widely debated question. What makes for the best 200M runners?

Is it Short Sprinters or Long Sprinters? Meaning 100M sprinters or 400M sprinters? That's the only fair battleground when it comes to sprints for all sprinters, i just wanna know which athlete makes for a better time. And please try to avoid using Michael Johnson examples because he's just a freak of nature.

[one_more_hurdler]

i'd say 100m runners

[Rob J]

defiantly 100m guys, though 400m guys can be good too.

[NJ5k]

100 guys. Crawford, Gatlin, Felix...

[teamV]

100 runners. With MJ as the exception, any elite 100 runner will beat any elite 400 runner in a 200.

Crawford, Gatlin, Felix...
by felix, do you mean allyson felix? i always thought she was mainly a 200 runner.

[Megaplaya]

Well two guys who run mainly the quarter have done exceptionally well in the 200M.

Xavier Carter and David Neville (http://iuhoosiers.collegesports.com/sports/m-track/mtt/nevilleiii_david00.html) have both run low 20 dots in the 200M.

If Wariner went up against crawford one on one in a 200M, i believe crawford would win simply because i think wariner is more of an endurance 400M runner than a speed 400M runner, but someone like Brewer would give him comp.

Just tryin 2 add some flava 2 the conversation.

[AtownTx-Jurdler]

i would say 100

[wilson]

i think wariner is more of an endurance 400M runner than a speed 400M runner.

He does have a state record in the 200 as well ya know.

[AtownTx-Jurdler]

If Wariner went up against crawford one on one in a 200M, i believe crawford would win simply because i think wariner is more of an endurance 400M runner than a speed 400M runner, but someone like Brewer would give him comp.

crawford would win because he has been training for the 200m while Wariner has not

and in all actuality, wariner is more of a speed 400m runner; which is backed up by MJ saying himself .. not a direct quote, but a paraphrase ... " Jeremy is a speed runner a lot like I was".. I think a reason you would think that though is because of his build .. and plus if im not mistaken, Wariner went 20.3 in highschool that says enough in itself

He does have a state record in the 200 as well ya know.

he doesn't have the state record in anything o.O

[adidas400]

i say 400 guys becAuse of ppl like xavier carter kelly willie

[Brumund-Smith]

Well let's look at the top 30 of all time and figure it out. I've highlighted the people who I figure could be considered 400/200 runners:

1. Michael Johnson, 19.32
2. Frank Fredricks, 19.68
3. Pietro Mennea, 19.72
4. Michael Marsh, 19.73
5. Carl Lewis, 19.75
5. Joe DeLoach, 19.75
7. Ato Boldon, 19.77
8. Shawn Crawford, 19.79
9. Tommie Smith, 19.83
10. Francis Obikwelu, 19.84
11. John Capel, 19.85
11. Konstadinos Kederis, 19.85
13. Donald Quarrie, 19.86
13. Maurice Greene, 19.86
13. Justin Gatlin, 19.86
16. Lorenzo Daniel, 19.87
16. John Regis, 19.87
16. Jeff Williams, 19.87
19. Floyd Heard, 19.88
19. Joshua Johnson, 19.88
21. Wallace Spearmon, 19.89
22. John Carlos, 19.92
23. Usain Bolt, 19.93
23. Tyson Gay, 19.93
25. Kirk Baptiste, 19.96
25. Robson Caetano da Silva, 19.96
25. Coby Miller, 19.96
28. Obadele Thompson, 19.97
29. Marcin Urbas, 19.98
30. Calvin Smith, 19.99

[Väinämöinen]

It is always easier to make improvements when moving up in distance than down.
The best 200 runners will be the best 100 runners just as the best 400 runners will be converted 200 runners and NOT 800 runners like many high school coaches believe.

[thabreeze]

Well let's look at the top 30 of all time and figure it out. I've highlighted the people who I figure could be considered 400/200 runners:

1. Michael Johnson, 19.32
2. Frank Fredricks, 19.68
3. Pietro Mennea, 19.72
4. Michael Marsh, 19.73
5. Carl Lewis, 19.75
5. Joe DeLoach, 19.75
7. Ato Boldon, 19.77
8. Shawn Crawford, 19.79
9. Tommie Smith, 19.83
10. Francis Obikwelu, 19.84
11. John Capel, 19.85
11. Konstadinos Kederis, 19.85
13. Donald Quarrie, 19.86
13. Maurice Greene, 19.86
13. Justin Gatlin, 19.86
16. Lorenzo Daniel, 19.87
16. John Regis, 19.87
16. Jeff Williams, 19.87
19. Floyd Heard, 19.88
19. Joshua Johnson, 19.88
21. Wallace Spearmon, 19.89
22. John Carlos, 19.92
23. Usain Bolt, 19.93
23. Tyson Gay, 19.93
25. Kirk Baptiste, 19.96
25. Robson Caetano da Silva, 19.96
25. Coby Miller, 19.96
28. Obadele Thompson, 19.97
29. Marcin Urbas, 19.98
30. Calvin Smith, 19.99
Usain Bolt is a 400 runner too.

[Brumund-Smith]

Usain Bolt is a 400 runner too.
Yeah I really didn't know whether to include him or not. I couldn't find a PR for him in either the 100m or 400m, but I know he's a decent relay guy in both.

[Megaplaya]

which is backed up by MJ saying himself .. not a direct quote, but a paraphrase ... " Jeremy is a speed runner a lot like I was".. I think a reason you would think that though is because of his build ..

I played to the stereotypes. Sorry. I thought he would be cause he's white.

[AtownTx-Jurdler]

I played to the stereotypes. Sorry. I thought he would be cause he's white.

its all good .. i thought the exact same thing because of his body build
.. but then I learned of his highschool 200m times and I heard MJ say that .. so yea that changed my mind

[aidan]

yeah.. after Wariner won the olympics, everyone wanted him to move up to the 800 for whatever reason... if anything, he should move down to the 200, considering that out of all the 400m finalists at the olympics, he had the fastest 200m pr!

p.s. - i think hes fine right where he is :)

[SUPERSPEED]

He does have a state record in the 200 as well ya know.

Wariner is from Texas, And The state record is 20.13 by Roy Martin. This is also the us national record, so wariner does not have a state record at 200 meters.

[AtownTx-Jurdler]

he also doesnt have the 400m state record

which i inferred from him saying .. "as well"

maybe he's talking about the state meet records? I dno what they are though

[Megaplaya]

question: How different is the racing strategy for SSs and LSs in the 200M, or is it the exact same?

[AtownTx-Jurdler]

question: How different is the racing strategy for SSs and LSs in the 200M, or is it the exact same?

theres a racing strategy for the 200?

theres no room for conservation of any kind in the 2

[thabreeze]

theres a racing strategy for the 200?
There's a racing stradegy for every race.

[maineXCrunner16]

MS for 200

[AtownTx-Jurdler]

There's a racing stradegy for every race.


well of course

though what i meant was like a strategy like in the quarter .. ie, go out fast first 75m or so, keep position to 200mark .. etc ..

as for the 2 hundred, what else can be said beside go out of the blocks as fast as you can and run as fast as you can

[InvisibleToEveryone]

well of course

though what i meant was like a strategy like in the quarter .. ie, go out fast first 75m or so, keep position to 200mark .. etc ..

as for the 2 hundred, what else can be said beside go out of the blocks as fast as you can and run as fast as you can

You've never ran a 200 have you?Theres no way you could have run it and possibly thought of that strategy

[AtownTx-Jurdler]

i could be totaly wrong
ive ran one 200 and I didnt think of one.



fulfill my curiosity and tell me what you do?

[Coreyc]

well of course

though what i meant was like a strategy like in the quarter .. ie, go out fast first 75m or so, keep position to 200mark .. etc ..

as for the 2 hundred, what else can be said beside go out of the blocks as fast as you can and run as fast as you can


Well considering you can only run at top speed for a matter of a second or two, and you cant run at full speed on a corner there is a strategy...use physics for your advantage to sling shot off the corner. The 200 is won and lost between 50 and 150 meters.

[AtownTx-Jurdler]

im not saying you will be at top speed the whole time
but i am saying that you cant hold back at all .. so you do run as fast as you can the entire time .. unlike something like the quarter where you actualy do hold back in some areas of the race .... wrong? I dno

[Coreyc]

Wrong....All elite sprinters have to use conserve their speed during the race. You are supposed to take it out hard out of the drive phase and then run the next 50 meters at about 95-98% which actually is quite substantial let off. Once you are nearing the end of the corner that is when you should open it up and sling shot off of the corner, that lasts you through about 150, the last 50 meters is just pure guts, form, and good training.

[AtownTx-Jurdler]

Wrong....All elite sprinters have to use conserve their speed during the race. You are supposed to take it out hard out of the drive phase and then run the next 50 meters at about 95-98% which actually is quite substantial let off. Once you are nearing the end of the corner that is when you should open it up and sling shot off of the corner, that lasts you through about 150, the last 50 meters is just pure guts, form, and good training.

hmm .. I see, thanks for clearing that up ..

I just never though one should conserve anything for the 2 .. now i know diff.
Though I honestly doubt many highschoolers do it .. goes to show what we dont know

[fasterthanu]

i am a 100 runner primarily run about a 10.8 100 and i ran the 200 and got a 22.5 so ima say 100

[Brumund-Smith]

i am a 100 runner primarily run about a 10.8 100 and i ran the 200 and got a 22.5 so ima say 100
Well I'm a 400m guy who probably couldn't break 11.5 in the 100m but have run a 22.2 in the 200m. Still, I think any good 100m runner could smoke me in the 200m.

[Megaplaya]

I think the guy from colorado. Scheurman?? He won the junior olympics 200M, and the 400M. +1 for quarter milers!

[Coach Rowland]

Michael Johson holds the 200m world record of 19.32 seconds...

Divide that by 2 and you get 100m splits of 9.66 seconds!!!

Hence, he is the fastest Human Being in history!!!!

[remiks]

Michael Johson holds the 200m world record of 19.32 seconds...

Divide that by 2 and you get 100m splits of 9.66 seconds!!!

Hence, he is the fastest Human Being in history!!!!

Yep, 10.35 meters per second

[shortput]

our best 100m runner is also out best 200m runner but we choose 200m runners by having a good old fashioned run off, it normlly splts about 50/50 half are SS the the others are LS

[Megaplaya]

To bad when Michael Johnson actually did do the 100M, i believe his best was only a 10.13.

[New Potato Caboose]

His best (from way back in 1994) was 10.09 with a +2.0 tailwind.
That year he also recorded bests of 43.90 and 19.94, a bit slower than the surrounding years.

[Coreyc]

Exactly, Carl Lewis, Mo Greene, "Bullet" Bob Hayes, are among some that have been timed around 9 seconds in the a 100m split of the 4x1.

[Coach Rowland]

Sorry but that holds absolutely NO water. What about all of those flying 100m from relays that are much faster than 9.66? You can't just divide a number to say it's the fastest. He had the best speed endurance, but surely he could not have run the best 100m or even near the fastest splits. Looking at his 200m WR shows that as he never approached the speeds need to run the 100m WR or sub 9.8 period.

I am sorry for not having out all of my reference material when making posts on here... Let me clarify for all of those on here who may believe that this is a forum for people to accurately recall ALL historical and published data from memory when making posts...lol...

We are here to make posts, openly discuss topics related to our sport... Having a forum like this for people of all levels, regions of this country to share and discuss ideas, training, etc... This is a great site to do this on and we shouldn't be taking anything personal or be directive at people for a comment... There are methods for reporting people who become stupid on here...

But, to defend my comment...I CAN say that, because he did it out of blocks... Not coming off of a running start and the clock starting when the hand off was complete... I know I divided it by two... As, stated before in an earlier thread by someon, his second 100m split was 9.2 when actually timed, but the point of the matter was his true speed from start, acceleration, to finish... He generated that much speed on his own from a complete stop... So, if you take into account MPS, he got pretty fast!! Relay splits aren't even in the same realm as the open sprints due to sprinters maybe getting the baton at the end of the exchange zone or something...

Once again, thank you all for taking the time to read and keep the threads alive...

[fasterthanu]

looka at justin gatlin in the world chapionships in helsinki over the summer. Justin is a 100 runner then look at wallace spearmon who is the 200 champion so i know hes not a 400 runner, so a 100 runner beat a primary 200 runner ill have to go with a dasher

[Brumund-Smith]

looka at justin gatlin in the world chapionships in helsinki over the summer. Justin is a 100 runner then look at wallace spearmon who is the 200 champion so i know hes not a 400 runner, so a 100 runner beat a primary 200 runner ill have to go with a dasher
Wallace Spearmon is primarily a 200m runner, yes. I'd say his second best event is the 400m, then the 100m. How he trains, I don't know. But I do know that Justin Gatlin was one heck of a 400m runner in high school and college. He split a 44.7 for Tennessee's 4x4 team in what was like his 11th race of the 2002 NCAA Championships. So I'm not sure that example really works. Also, you can't just look at ONE example and have that make your whole case, ESPECIALLY this example.

[Brumund-Smith]

But, to defend my comment...I CAN say that, because he did it out of blocks... Not coming off of a running start and the clock starting when the hand off was complete... I know I divided it by two... As, stated before in an earlier thread by someon, his second 100m split was 9.2 when actually timed, but the point of the matter was his true speed from start, acceleration, to finish... He generated that much speed on his own from a complete stop... So, if you take into account MPS, he got pretty fast!! Relay splits aren't even in the same realm as the open sprints due to sprinters maybe getting the baton at the end of the exchange zone or something...
If you're going to call yourself a coach, then at least pretend to have a clue. Relay splits taken when the person receives the baton? Sorry, but no. Any good coach will correctly inform you that you take relay splits line-to-line. That means an accurate 4x1 split is taken from the middle of each exchange zone. So you're little theory about Michael Johnson being the fastest man of all time because of his 200m time is almost completely baseless.

Coming out of blocks? That is an advantage. People who run anchor leg on the 4x1 don't get to come out of blocks. They have to build up speed as quickly as possible from a crouch (not to mention starting out looking behind themselves). I know MJ is going to get more tired in the first 100m than the 4x1 guys will get in the first 20m (counting the exchange zone) so the relay splits for the final 100m SHOULD be faster than the last 100m of a 200m dash. But you have no real basis for MJ's 19.32 being the fastest a human being has ever run.

[Megaplaya]

I just wanted to throw in that Mo Greene can take 4 steps in one second :eek:

[thabreeze]

I think Mo Greene is the fastest ever. Not sure about the actual facts, but I remember reading somewhere that his 9.79 was with very little wind and I think with no wind it equates to a 9.80. Whereas Powell's WR was with a stronger tailwind wind and with no wind equates to a 9.9 smething or a high 9.8. So even though Mo Greene doesn't have the WR, he still has the fastest 100m performance ever.

[driven]

Wrong....All elite sprinters have to use conserve their speed during the race. You are supposed to take it out hard out of the drive phase and then run the next 50 meters at about 95-98% which actually is quite substantial let off. Once you are nearing the end of the corner that is when you should open it up and sling shot off of the corner, that lasts you through about 150, the last 50 meters is just pure guts, form, and good training.

so what do you do on an indoor track when you possibly have 2 turns or something else like that?

[Coreyc]

Indoor is a different story especially if you are on a smaller track. There isn't much speed conservation because of the sharp corners. The best advice I can give is to stay relaxed on the tight corners and dont try to fight them too much. Stay relaxed and concentrate on swinging your outside arm over your midline to help counter act some of the force trying to pull you out of your lane. Stay relaxed and concentrate on keeping form the last 40m when your probably pretty tired.

[AtownTx-Jurdler]

Indoor is a different story especially if you are on a smaller track. There isn't much speed conservation because of the sharp corners. The best advice I can give is to stay relaxed on the tight corners and dont try to fight them too much. Stay relaxed and concentrate on swinging your outside arm over your midline to help counter act some of the force trying to pull you out of your lane. Stay relaxed and concentrate on keeping form the last 40m when your probably pretty tired.

in other words .. stay relaxed :)

[Coreyc]

in other words .. stay relaxed :)

Haha...I did say that 3 times didn't I, I get a little long winder sometimes :)