Shaquan Brown

[tach44444]

since dwacox isn't on this yet, i suppose i'll say it...Shaquan Brown ran the 800 leg of the SMR at the Passaic County Relays. 1:56, coming from behind Group IV indoor 800 champ. hayrol cruz to win. cruz ran 1:57. and i believe that was the last of his 4 events. proves he can run a decent 800, al beit this was not his first 800 attempt, but was his first sub-2 effort.

[king99]

I think this is a major indication..I am fairly sure Shaq Brown is the type that can run 400-800 with anyone, provided he gets in over distance work, and longer intervals. I think he's a 1:52 type waiting to happen. H e has ability to glide by in 54 come back in 58 or so.

[dwacox]

Just a couple of notes about the sprint medley H cruz had already run a 1600 and an 800 leg of the dmr and 4x800 and he and Shaquan got the stick at the same time.
The interesting thing of the race was no one knew if shaq was going to run till the 400 leg was comming down the homestretch because he was having legcramps before the race and coach Samara was working on his legs to try and allieviate them he ran the other 3 legs just in case shaq could run and at the worst they could get some work in
Shaq ran 780 meters of that race before the leg cramps got severe again so he limped the last 20 meters and collapsed after the finish line so they could work on his legs again
I am pretty sure he will run the smr this week in jersey cityor the 4x800 and he will probably run in the 153 range

[king99]

Someone has to question why or how Cruz winds up running 4K of hard efforts in an April event?

Better yet how does he run 1:57 on 4th race..split accuracy??

[king99]

Dwayne..my good man..YOU said and this is why you really need punctuation in your posts:

That Cruz had run 1600, 800 in DMR and on 4 x 8 before SMR?

I did not come to this by myself..how about fixing that.

Even your clarification does not clarify anything as you have him running 1600M relay which i would think is 4 x 4 ..twice..

Sorry, but it is impossible to follow. And now looks entirely different from what you first posted..which clearly says.

he ran 1600, then 800 in DMR , then 4 x 8(which would have to be an 800)

then the sprint Med anchor?

[dwacox]

Dwayne..my good man..YOU said and this is why you really need punctuation in your posts:

That Cruz had run 1600, 800 in DMR and on 4 x 8 before SMR?

I did not come to this by myself..how about fixing that.

Even your clarification does not clarify anything as you have him running 1600M relay which i would think is 4 x 4 ..twice..

Sorry, but it is impossible to follow. And now looks entirely different from what you first posted..which clearly says.

he ran 1600, then 800 in DMR , then 4 x 8(which would have to be an 800)

then the sprint Med anchor?


this is what I said
Just a couple of notes about the sprint medley H cruz had already run a 1600 and an 800 leg of the dmr and 4x800 and he and Shaquan got the stick at the same time.

[king99]

dwayn e from what you say..how could one ever deduce anyhting else,other than that Cruz ran:

a 1600

and 800 on DMR

and an 800 on 4 x 800

ALL before the Sprint med?

According to your other post:

He ran 2 400's and an 800? you then said 440 in the 1600, I am assuming "4x4 relay?", a 400 in the 4 x 4, which is the same thing..AND an 800 in the 4 x 8


Your first post says:

He ran 1600

800 in DMR

800 in 4 x 8

Then 800 in SMR

OR did he run 5 races?

[runinstripes]

dwayn e from what you say..how could one ever deduce anyhting else,other than that Cruz ran:

a 1600

and 800 on DMR

and an 800 on 4 x 800

ALL before the Sprint med?

According to your other post:

He ran 2 400's and an 800? you then said 440 in the 1600, I am assuming "4x4 relay?", a 400 in the 4 x 4, which is the same thing..AND an 800 in the 4 x 8


Your first post says:

He ran 1600

800 in DMR

800 in 4 x 8

Then 800 in SMR

OR did he run 5 races?

Greg Leach of CBA ran a 4x1600, 4x800, 800 on a SMR, and a 4x400 leg...Does anyone else think that this was a bit much for early April?

[king99]

I don;t often question guys like Tom Heath..altho with Penn two weeks away this may have been hard work day and they may go easy now for next ten days or so?

[78Champ]

Greg Leach of CBA ran a 4x1600, 4x800, 800 on a SMR, and a 4x400 leg...Does anyone else think that this was a bit much for early April?

I heard he didn't have to run that hard on the 4x1600. Guy chasing him didn't scare him!!!! :D

JW

p.s. - If you are going to run a quad (as a hard training day), isn't early April the best time to do it?

[runinstripes]

I heard he didn't have to run that hard on the 4x1600. Guy chasing him didn't scare him!!!! :D

JW

p.s. - If you are going to run a quad (as a hard training day), isn't early April the best time to do it?

Haha...I don't know...I don't see racing a quad as a hard training day...so many factors such as unequal rests between races..standing/sitting rests..etc. But then again, I am not the great Tom Heath ;)

[78Champ]

Haha...I don't know...I don't see racing a quad as a hard training day...so many factors such as unequal rests between races..standing/sitting rests..etc. But then again, I am not the great Tom Heath ;)

But there is also more to this then just the training for fitness aspect. Some guys don't double well. This helps the learning process for that as well. Learning what you, as an individual, need to, can or can't do between races is important.

Not saying this is the case for Leach but could be a factor in a coach running guys multiple times, in preparation for a later, more important, double or return in finals.

JW

[reyp]

dwa, hayrol actually ran a 1600(4:40) then two 800's (4*800 and sprintmedley)both 1:57 and then ran a 50.** leg on the 4by400. still pretty good day. and king is hard to actually tell what kind of runner shaq can be because personally i think he can break 21 in the 200 with some improvement on his start.

[tach44444]

well can you be a 200/800 type guy? the guy is talented, but once he gets to college or on a national level, you can't be doing 200, 400, and 800. i still think his best event is the 400.

[dwacox]

well can you be a 200/800 type guy? the guy is talented, but once he gets to college or on a national level, you can't be doing 200, 400, and 800. i still think his best event is the 400.

I think his future (in college or beyond will be a 400/800 runner) his 800 potential is scary

[Joe Lanzalotto]

I think his future (in college or beyond will be a 400/800 runner) his 800 potential is scary

Dwayne, you are certainly in a much better position to know that than anyone else on here. My question is, why when he is still so (relatively) inexperienced at 400, is everyone in such a hurry to move him up to 800? It doesn't apprear that he has come near fulfilling his potential at 400. Shouldn't he do that first or is there another reaosn for him to move up?

I know that it is a matter of curiosity to see what he can do in the longer event, but I am even more curious to see if he can run 45-point this year and who knows what next.

[MaestroXC]

Are you serious? When was the last time an NJ runner ran 45.X?

If it's a split, that's one thing, but open? I don't see that happening.

[tach44444]

according to my sources brown just ran 1:58. in duel meet at Clifton

[dwacox]

according to my sources brown just ran 1:58. in duel meet at Clifton
good sources :)

[bongturk]

there is much more competition in the 400 than in the 800 at the top level in the US. he would be much better moving up now and getting several years of 800 type training before he reaches his full physical maturity. yes he probably will be a top 400 runner but i think he could also be an excellent 800 runner and have a much better chance of getting near the top in that event.

[RBroady]

I remember reading that he was going to give up football and run XC next year. That cant do anything but help him for the 800, no football= less risk of injury as well, which is good. Id like to see him run the 800, maybe it will be this spring, hopefully, since i will not be around next year. But maybe he wants to wait a year and run XC until he really gets into the 800. I have only seen him race twice but he looks like he has the build to be strong in the 800. I think anyone that has good speed and can possibly step up to the 800 should do it, especially when you post a national record in the 600, its obviuse he can do damage in the 800

[Joe Lanzalotto]

Are you serious? When was the last time an NJ runner ran 45.X?

If it's a split, that's one thing, but open? I don't see that happening.

And no one would have believed Marty running under 4:00 or Webb running 3:53, etc. Why limit him? Other people, have in fact done it and just because it's rare doesn't mean it can't be done. It HAS been done, just not in this state, although Mitchell was close at 46.02 and Ron Freeman must have been close too.

Brown ran 47.8 as an inexperienced soph. If you want to limit his upside, that's your business. I think he has a shot.

[Joe Lanzalotto]

there is much more competition in the 400 than in the 800 at the top level in the US. he would be much better moving up now and getting several years of 800 type training before he reaches his full physical maturity. yes he probably will be a top 400 runner but i think he could also be an excellent 800 runner and have a much better chance of getting near the top in that event.

I agree about the fact that there is more competition at 400 than 800, but to me, avoiding tougher competition is not a reason to change events. Head to head with the best guys in the country will only make him better.

[tach44444]

I remember reading that he was going to give up football and run XC next year. That cant do anything but help him for the 800

oo yea, since wen is a good 400/800 guy good at xc? rob novak, mike pachella, mike carmody, greg gomez, ect. ect. have never done exceptional at xc. so why subject brown to xc and fall into the steriotypical "track ***" groove. let him train for 400/800 on his own, y does he have to play a sport in the fall. if he is really dedicated to being the best 4/8 runner he can be, xc won't help that much.

don't get me wrong here, i believe the key to being a great 800 runner is a hude aerobic base, but running long slow miles over the summer for brown won't benefit him as much as you people seem to think.

do world class 800 runners run xc? not most of them, so y run xc just cuz everyone else is? do your own thing.

[GeorgieTheK]

let him train for 400/800 on his own, y does he have to play a sport in the fall. if he is really dedicated to being the best 4/8 runner he can be, xc won't help that much.

don't get me wrong here, i believe the key to being a great 800 runner is a hude aerobic base, but running long slow miles over the summer for brown won't benefit him as much as you people seem to think.

do world class 800 runners run xc? not most of them, so y run xc just cuz everyone else is? do your own thing.

World class 800 runners don't run XC because on the elite level, XC is 12k - which is a bit far for a half-miler.

That said, world class 800 runners often times log lots of miles in their base phase. Rich Kenah and Wilson Kipketer, for example, would run close to 100 mile weeks in their base phase.

I agree that Shaquan Brown does not HAVE to run XC, but I think if he is going to move up to the 800 full time, it will help him (although if he wants to remain a 200/400 guy, there is no point of running XC).

At the h.s. level, with XC races being relatively short, a good 800 runner can run well at XC. Not earth-shattering, but much better than most. Running XC teaches 800 runners patience and tactics. It also gets them used to hurting for a long period of time.

XC or not, it's wise to avoid football for the simple reason that you lessen the chance of injury.

[RBroady]

oo yea, since wen is a good 400/800 guy good at xc? rob novak, mike pachella, mike carmody, greg gomez, ect. ect. have never done exceptional at xc. so why subject brown to xc and fall into the steriotypical "track ***" groove. let him train for 400/800 on his own, y does he have to play a sport in the fall. if he is really dedicated to being the best 4/8 runner he can be, xc won't help that much.

don't get me wrong here, i believe the key to being a great 800 runner is a hude aerobic base, but running long slow miles over the summer for brown won't benefit him as much as you people seem to think.

do world class 800 runners run xc? not most of them, so y run xc just cuz everyone else is? do your own thing.

since when has it ever hurt them? like you said, the key to being a great 800 runner is to build up an aerobic base, so why not train with your XC team? and having brown "do his own thing"???....its highly likely that Brown would benefit from being under the instruction of his coach during the XC season then "doing his own thing".

[78Champ]

oo yea, since wen is a good 400/800 guy good at xc? rob novak, mike pachella, mike carmody, greg gomez, ect. ect. have never done exceptional at xc. so why subject brown to xc and fall into the steriotypical "track ***" groove. let him train for 400/800 on his own, y does he have to play a sport in the fall. if he is really dedicated to being the best 4/8 runner he can be, xc won't help that much.

don't get me wrong here, i believe the key to being a great 800 runner is a hude aerobic base, but running long slow miles over the summer for brown won't benefit him as much as you people seem to think.

do world class 800 runners run xc? not most of them, so y run xc just cuz everyone else is? do your own thing.

Wow tach...just wow. "track ***"????? Shaq will do what he and his coaches think is best for him. He has some pretty good people, who have had some pretty good successes, around him. Nobody, including his own support group, is expecting him to do "exceptional" in XC. I am pretty sure the intent is to make him a better 800 runner. To move up in distance you have to ummm...move up in distance, pretty simple concept.

Even if he wasn't moving up, I have said this before. Even a 400 meter runner can benefit from being "on the XC team". Just because you are in the XC team, does not mean you have to train for XC. XC/Track, is lucky that way. Could you imagine going out for the soccer team but practicing for basketball?

JW

[MaestroXC]

oo yea, since wen is a good 400/800 guy good at xc? rob novak, mike pachella, mike carmody, greg gomez, ect. ect. have never done exceptional at xc.

Don't be stupid. How about Robert Edwards, John Carlotti and even John Richardson? Just because some 800 guys don't excel at XC doesn't mean he shouldn't give it a shot.

Joe L: Please don't misconstrue what I was saying about Shaquan's 400 potential; I'm not "limiting" anyone here. I was just shocked that you'd predict a sub 46 second clocking this year. By senior year, possibly, but this year it seems premature to predict such a drastic improvement into historically uncharted territory.

[Joe Lanzalotto]

Don't be stupid. How about Robert Edwards, John Carlotti and even John Richardson? Just because some 800 guys don't excel at XC doesn't mean he shouldn't give it a shot.

Joe L: Please don't misconstrue what I was saying about Shaquan's 400 potential; I'm not "limiting" anyone here. I was just shocked that you'd predict a sub 46 second clocking this year. By senior year, possibly, but this year it seems premature to predict such a drastic improvement into historically uncharted territory.

Maestro, I wasn't predicting that he would run 45-point this year, I said I was "curious" to see if he could. The reasons that I would think it was a possibility are that he is clearly a strong guy who is still relatively inexperienced at even running 400. He is also very fast - someone said that they would be surprised to see him run 21 flat or something like that. I agree. And he has now run a "decent" 800 - 1:56. No predictions, but I think that the elements are there. It will be fun to watch and see what happens.

Great examples on the XC/800 issue.

[Joe Lanzalotto]

oo yea, since wen is a good 400/800 guy good at xc? rob novak, mike pachella, mike carmody, greg gomez, ect. ect. have never done exceptional at xc. so why subject brown to xc and fall into the steriotypical "track ***" groove. let him train for 400/800 on his own, y does he have to play a sport in the fall. if he is really dedicated to being the best 4/8 runner he can be, xc won't help that much.

don't get me wrong here, i believe the key to being a great 800 runner is a hude aerobic base, but running long slow miles over the summer for brown won't benefit him as much as you people seem to think.

do world class 800 runners run xc? not most of them, so y run xc just cuz everyone else is? do your own thing.

I know a lot of 400 (not even 800) guys who have run XC every year in high school and benefited greatly from it. For one thing, it keeps them away from the potential of football injuries. For another, when woud you rather get in shape - September or in the cold of November/December. being on the team is a big thing, and I can think of more than a few 400 guys who ended up being on their XC team. Not world beaters for sure, but they helped the team. Not a thing wrong with that.

[king99]

First of all I can't see Shaq Brown as good as he is going 45.xx this year? Next? Maybe..dropping over 1.2 seconds from the Armory isn;t easy, ask Ray Williams and lance Wigfall.

However, going sub 1:52 is a definte possibility, as to why move up? I say why not, we literally have probably 100+ a lot, guys in this country who can at least split 45.xx

at the next level we have way less that can run under 1:46..I have seen Brown in person and he is an 800 horror show who is waiting to happen.

and Tach? On the "track ***" quote? What is that about? Guys that run 3 seaosn are "Track ***s"??

Also you have listed the wrong guys there as 400-800 runners..none of them is/was a serious threat at 400M , save maybe Carmody

and he is not a 400 threat at the next level either, Gomez is talented but with wheels for the 800 not the 400.Not at the DI Big East or National level. He's a nice 4th as a fill in on your 4 x 4.

[MaestroXC]

Last year at Sectionals and Groups, Gomez ran:
1 Greg Gomez SR FRANKLIN 48.77 4 10
2 Greg Gomez SR FRANKLIN 48.56 3 8

As opposed to Carmody's set of
1 Mike Carmody SR GOV LIVINGSTON 48.03 4 10
1 Mike Carmody SR GOV LIVINGSTON 48.39 3 10


At the 200 distance, Carmody also ran this last year at the sectionals:
2 Mike Carmody SR GOV LIVINGSTON 22.72 8

I can't find any state meet results for Gomez at the 200, but from our conference meets I remember him running in the 22 second range as well.

The way I see it, Gomez is only a few steps behind Carmody at any distance under 800, and a comparable talent at 400.

[reilly74]

Hand-timed results from 2004 Somerset County meet. After running a 1:54.3 800.

200:

1. Kyle Calvo (Somerville) 21.6;

2. Jason Bradley (Somerville) 22.1;

3. Greg Gomez (Franklin) 22.4;

4. Stanley Howard (Franklin) 22.6;

5. Matt Mitchell (Ridge) 22.7;

6. Carlos Amarilla (Bernards) 23.1.

[MaestroXC]

Thanks, reilly.

That time, converted to FAT, is equal to 22.64, a mite faster than Carmody's 200.

[king99]

Aye aye aye,,

Since neither Gomez NOT Carmody will ever be running any 200's in colege I did not use their 200M times

carmody was faster at 400 every day of the week and those were in middle of brutal triples or quad after running 1600?

My point was neither of those guys would see the 400M much in college.And that, yes, Carmosy was faster at 400

I did not use 200, an event Gomez ran quite a bit..and Carmody rarely?

[tach44444]

World class 800 runners don't run XC because on the elite level, XC is 12k - which is a bit far for a half-miler.

That said, world class 800 runners often times log lots of miles in their base phase. Rich Kenah and Wilson Kipketer, for example, would run close to 100 mile weeks in their base phase.

I agree that Shaquan Brown does not HAVE to run XC, but I think if he is going to move up to the 800 full time, it will help him (although if he wants to remain a 200/400 guy, there is no point of running XC).

At the h.s. level, with XC races being relatively short, a good 800 runner can run well at XC. Not earth-shattering, but much better than most. Running XC teaches 800 runners patience and tactics. It also gets them used to hurting for a long period of time.

XC or not, it's wise to avoid football for the simple reason that you lessen the chance of injury.

at world XC's they have the 4k buster. 4k is about 2.5 miles. is that short enough for your 800 runners?

even if brown moves up to the 800 full time he will still be a 400/800 type guy, not a 800/mile type, so he needs to keep that basic speed in him, and xc won't help as much as you think.

is brown not on a national level yet? don't think small man, think big and outside the box. he's good, so y are u almost forcing him to waste his talent and be passive about running?

as for mileage for a 800 runner, those over 100 miles a week is not true. many 800 runners have been notorius for running "20" mile weeks and around there. no need to go in more depth, cuz i'm lazy right now.

[tach44444]

Don't be stupid. How about Robert Edwards, John Carlotti and even John Richardson? Just because some 800 guys don't excel at XC doesn't mean he shouldn't give it a shot.

you guys are all missing a key element to all this.

all those guys you just mentioned are 800/mile runners meaning they are running the 800 from a strength back ground. shaq is a 400/800 runner, coming from a speed background in respect to the 800.

[tach44444]

I know a lot of 400 (not even 800) guys who have run XC every year in high school and benefited greatly from it. For one thing, it keeps them away from the potential of football injuries. For another, when woud you rather get in shape - September or in the cold of November/December. being on the team is a big thing, and I can think of more than a few 400 guys who ended up being on their XC team. Not world beaters for sure, but they helped the team. Not a thing wrong with that.

so instead of having brown train specifically for the 800, or get in a swift, solid base for the 800, u want him to help his xc team improve on their 14th place finish at Group IV, North I sectionals last year? nothing against kennedy, but it is my firm conviction that brown would be served best if hey trained on his own, targeting his training and efforts towards the 400/800. could he run xc, and still be amazing? yes, and i bet that is wat is going to happen anyways.

i still stand beside my point that 800 runners are not all that great at xc, and are just not the same body type, build, and conditioning for it. specifically those that are 400/800 runners.

[Joe Lanzalotto]

so instead of having brown train specifically for the 800, or get in a swift, solid base for the 800, u want him to help his xc team improve on their 14th place finish at Group IV, North I sectionals last year? nothing against kennedy, but it is my firm conviction that brown would be served best if hey trained on his own, targeting his training and efforts towards the 400/800. could he run xc, and still be amazing? yes, and i bet that is wat is going to happen anyways.

i still stand beside my point that 800 runners are not all that great at xc, and are just not the same body type, build, and conditioning for it. specifically those that are 400/800 runners.

Totally disagree with what you are saying here. Almost any runner will benefit from a good mileage base, and probably will not benefit from doing 400/800 specific work in September. He would be running those events through June of the next year. Are you saying you want him to start doing the specific work required for 400/800 10 months earlier? That's absurd.

And again, I can tell you from personal experience of 400/800 types who ran XC, helped the team and went on to have strong track seasons (both). Guys who ran 1:53.1, 50.3, 1:55, times like that.

[tach44444]

Also you have listed the wrong guys there as 400-800 runners..none of them is/was a serious threat at 400M , save maybe Carmody

and he is not a 400 threat at the next level either, Gomez is talented but with wheels for the 800 not the 400.Not at the DI Big East or National level. He's a nice 4th as a fill in on your 4 x 4.

that proves my point even more. we have guys that rely on strength more than speed to run good 800's and not even they are amazing at xc, so y put a guy that relys more on speed than distance in xc?

brown is built to run 400/800 more than 800/mile. no one i hope will disagree with that. by running xc, he puts in a base probably of the right volume but slower than wat is neccessary to efficently get him into 800 shape. if he runs xc, and say he trains for it, he will need, for ex, 7 miles a day total or 49 a week. even if he ran those miles at 7:00 pace (PR in the mile 4:57?) which is wat i assume he would be doing them in. is running 50 miles a week at 7:00 pace from august to november going to put shaq in position to dominate the nation his senior year in the 800? i think not. bryan scotland didn't run xc into the post-season for a reason. that same reason should be y shaq doesn't run xc at all.

[king99]

Don't use Scotland in this analysis. almost anyone you ask would have said he should have kept up with XC longer..His best races in indoors were way earlier than necessary

Brown doesn't need to run 50 miles a week at 7 minute per..there is a level and a pace that would prove incredibly beneficial to him

[jersey_guy]

tach is correct in that since Shaq can run a 400m in 47 or even a 600 in 1:17, his leg muscle fiber type is likely to be at least 75% fast-twitch, which is very unresponsive to aerobic training, although I of course do not know the true figure. So I doubt if running 50 miles a week at 7:00 pace for several months would be the best way to train.

[bongturk]

joe l this is a little late ,but in regards to "avoiding competition" on any level, if there are ten people vying for three spots vs three or four people vying for three spots, assuming all people are of similar ability, if i'm coaching one of those people i'm going to encourage him to go where he has the best chance to get one of those three spots.
all of this talk about brown as an 800 runner is at this point just idle speculation. my comments were related to way down the road when he "might" be in a position to try to make the olympic team (yes, very idle speculation). since the 400 is arguably america's strongest event why wouldn't an athlete go where he had the best chance to make the team? i doubt if anyone i know would criticize an athlete for moving up in any event if it gave him a better chance to become an olympian.(actually the same argument holds true for any level. are you going to criticize a kid who takes the best road to win a state championship because the competition was tougher in another event? i've never seen or heard anyone do that.

[Whatever]

as for mileage for a 800 runner, those over 100 miles a week is not true. many 800 runners have been notorius for running "20" mile weeks and around there. no need to go in more depth, cuz i'm lazy right now.

I have to believe that Georgie would have a good idea of the milage that Rich Kenah was doing.

[GeorgieTheK]

as for mileage for a 800 runner, those over 100 miles a week is not true. many 800 runners have been notorius for running "20" mile weeks and around there. no need to go in more depth, cuz i'm lazy right now.

20 mile weeks? For which elite 800 runners? Even 400/800 guys like Mark Everett ran more than double that mileage. And yes, Kenah was logging 90 mile weeks in base phase. Not that rare - plenty of college 800 guys are running 55-60 in the base phase.

Listen, I understand your aversion to Shaquan Brown running XC. You're right - he's more of a 200/400 guy than a 400/800 guy.... AT THIS POINT. I think what others were saying, is that if he is serious about moving up to the 800 full-time, then he will have to increase his mileage.

One of the ways he can get started, is by running XC. I don't expect him to dominate anyone, or even help his team improve it's showing at conference or sectional meets. I think it would be beneficial to help develop aerobic capacity, as well as get a handle on things like running in a pack, running from behind, finishing well. Even if he doesn't run flat out in races, a 5k for a guy like him is in the perfect tempo run range - 18:00 minutes or so.

Like I said before, simply not playing football will lessen his chance of injury. Running XC, may help him if he's planning on moving up. If he is not, then fall conditioning with his track coach will serve him well.

[Joe Lanzalotto]

joe l this is a little late ,but in regards to "avoiding competition" on any level, if there are ten people vying for three spots vs three or four people vying for three spots, assuming all people are of similar ability, if i'm coaching one of those people i'm going to encourage him to go where he has the best chance to get one of those three spots.
all of this talk about brown as an 800 runner is at this point just idle speculation. my comments were related to way down the road when he "might" be in a position to try to make the olympic team (yes, very idle speculation). since the 400 is arguably america's strongest event why wouldn't an athlete go where he had the best chance to make the team? i doubt if anyone i know would criticize an athlete for moving up in any event if it gave him a better chance to become an olympian.(actually the same argument holds true for any level. are you going to criticize a kid who takes the best road to win a state championship because the competition was tougher in another event? i've never seen or heard anyone do that.

Well, I guess we just disagree on this one. I wouldn't move to another event just to make it easier to get a high school state title. I would want to go head to head with the best, especially if it were in my primary event. The Olympics? Maybe a slightly different story there!

[quakerxc]

oo yea, since wen is a good 400/800 guy good at xc? rob novak, mike pachella, mike carmody, greg gomez, ect. ect. have never done exceptional at xc. so why subject brown to xc and fall into the steriotypical "track ***" groove. let him train for 400/800 on his own, y does he have to play a sport in the fall. if he is really dedicated to being the best 4/8 runner he can be, xc won't help that much.

don't get me wrong here, i believe the key to being a great 800 runner is a hude aerobic base, but running long slow miles over the summer for brown won't benefit him as much as you people seem to think.

do world class 800 runners run xc? not most of them, so y run xc just cuz everyone else is? do your own thing.
XC won't help him for the 800m? Tell that to Dave Wottle, George Kersh, etc. (even Courtney Jaworski ran much better indoors this year after running XC for I believe the first time in college). XC training can be great for an 800 guy. Tempo runs, some longer repeats, etc. are really beneficial in building the endurance necessary to run an 800 fast throughout. When I hear he's doing XC, these are the things I see him doing, not "50 mpw at 7:00 pace."

What do you know, a high school guy using the word "***." How steriotypical.

[Scotty]

Unlike some of the guys mentioned - Kersh, Jaworski, Kenah, Woddle - Shaq Brown is a 400/600 guy who can move to the 200 or the 800 simply because he is a superior talent. In other worrds, he's just so good, he'll run anything well. However, from what I can see, in no way is he a guy who can move to 1500. XC will almost NEVER hurt a kid (it makes ALL 800m guys better at their event), but Shaq would be best served by doing trail runs and hill-bounding than he would actually training like an XC guy. Doing so will enable him to stretch more effectively to 800m.

With a 47.53 last spring, and a 1:18.04c indoors, he is a prototypical long sprinter. Kersh, Jaworski, Kenah and Woddle were not.

[tach44444]

Unlike some of the guys mentioned - Kersh, Jaworski, Kenah, Woddle - Shaq Brown is a 400/600 guy who can move to the 200 or the 800 simply because he is a superior talent. In other worrds, he's just so good, he'll run anything well. However, from what I can see, in no way is he a guy who can move to 1500. XC will almost NEVER hurt a kid (it makes ALL 800m guys better at their event), but Shaq would be best served by doing trail runs and hill-bounding than he would actually training like an XC guy. Doing so will enable him to stretch more effectively to 800m.

With a 47.53 last spring, and a 1:18.04c indoors, he is a prototypical long sprinter. Kersh, Jaworski, Kenah and Woddle were not.

thank you for agreeing with me. i was in no way saying xc would hurt the guy. thats just common sense it would benefit him assuming it isn't over done. im say, if u r going to bw good at something, y not become great at it? my main point was he will become better at the 400/800 if did base training specific to those races as opposed to running xc. that means hill bounding, hills, faster tempo runs, shorter fartleks, lifting, plyometrics, core stability work, stride efficency, and the list goes on.

if he ran xc, he would be racing 2 times a week, or about 10-15 races over 3 months. by avoiding all this racing 5k's, and being stuck with team obligations, he can do his own thing, and partake in all those little extras as listed above, and become that much better.

[tach44444]

What do you know, a high school guy using the word "***." How steriotypical.

and wat the hell do u know? a 22 year old listing 2 people as an example of 800 runners improving through xc? obviously they improved, but to their utmost potential? how bout some hard facts/evidence tough guy?

[GeorgieTheK]

my main point was he will become better at the 400/800 if did base training specific to those races as opposed to running xc. that means hill bounding, hills, faster tempo runs, shorter fartleks, lifting, plyometrics, core stability work, stride efficency, and the list goes on.



i agree that if he wants to be a 400 guy, then fall training is the way to go.

but, if he wants to run the 800 full time, then XC would probably be best for him right now. what he lacks now is not core stability and stride efficiency, but aerobic capacity. he can do all the hill bounding in the world, but that won't improve his aerobic capactity. those things are nice - but not a subsitute for mileage. why can't he do those things and run XC?

as for facts about 800 guys who benefit from XC, or at least high mileage, the evidence is stacked against you:

kipketer, coe, kenah, everett for starters.

on the collegiate level, georgetown's entire 800 corps would run 2-3 xc races in the fall - ending with the 10k at IC4as. Bryan Woodward, NCAA champ, owner of PRs of 44+ on a 1600 relay and 1:45 open 800 ran in the low 32s for 10k one year in XC, beating lots of very good college milers and 5k guys along the way.

so far, you've provided NO 800 runner who runs low mileage and never ran XC.

[quakerxc]

and wat the hell do u know? a 22 year old listing 2 people as an example of 800 runners improving through xc? obviously they improved, but to their utmost potential? how bout some hard facts/evidence tough guy?
I'm not 22.

I would give you "hard facts/evidence" but Scotty and Georgie have already done so and you obviously didn't read Scotty's post, so why would you read mine? I won't waste my time (I understand I'm wasting my time responding to you at all, but it's much less time) especially when you're calling me a tough guy.

Please learn how to spell. Sadly, I'm sure you didn't even get my joke in my post.

[king99]

Another thing, Brown is so fast on the low end or should be by the time he is a senior the other guys mentioned will NOT even apply..Brown if trained right..long sprinter or not should be able to run under 1:50 as an after thought

He will be able theroreticlly only to run what at the Armory? a RIDICULOUS 1:16.xx? come on..like it or not none of the longer guys ran even near that.

Brown goes 46.5 or better this year and 1:52 as a junior if he so desires

anyone who has seen him in person and thats not even the bulk of folks that post on this, could easily see he is built for whatever distance he chooses or chose.

he is long legged..smooth striding monster talent, in NJ? maybe of all time..and thats a tough list of mine to even crack.

[Scotty]

i agree that if he wants to be a 400 guy, then fall training is the way to go.

but, if he wants to run the 800 full time, then XC would probably be best for him right now. what he lacks now is not core stability and stride efficiency, but aerobic capacity. he can do all the hill bounding in the world, but that won't improve his aerobic capactity. those things are nice - but not a subsitute for mileage. why can't he do those things and run XC?

kipketer, coe, kenah, everett....

.

The thing to keep in mind, as stated previously, is that Shaq and the Coe/Kenahs of the world are entirely different. Coe was an 800/1000/1500/mile guy (and the best runner I ever saw). Kenah was an 800/1500 guy. Shaq is a 400/600 guy who can move up and down because he is so good. "Running XC" means training like every other guy on the XC team. IMO, not the best plan for SB, while it was essential for a Rich Kenah. Shaq can, as I posted, supplement his hill bounding with trail runs of 4-5 miles, and significantly improve his strength. This is essential if he is to be a dominant 800 guy. Could he simply train/race with the enire XC team? Sure. Is that the way I would go if I were coaching SB? Definitely not.

BTW, I agree that Everett is a closer to Shag than the others. He was an 800 guy who could move down. SB, a 4/6 type who can (likely) move up. In the end, there are diffent ways to train the same athlete. Determining the correct path is the trick.

[tach44444]

He will be able theroreticlly only to run what at the Armory? a RIDICULOUS 1:16.xx? come on..like it or not none of the longer guys ran even near that.


before he broke 1:20, i believe it was after he ran 1:20.3 at his county championship or league, i said on the old message board he was going to run 1:16 by senior year. and all hell broke lose, with everyone bashing me and talking smack. not to shove it back in all your faces, but he has the ability to run it, and king just agreed with me. i just felt the need to bring that up because i was persicuted quite severly as i am taking shots at from u guys right now.

[king99]

Scotty has it right, of course.

Brown is the best talent at 400-600, I have seen in NJ , so I am assuming which is a lot, a high quality 800 should happen for him unless he shows he could not ever handle the diatnce in a big spot.As Scotty alluded to off his talent alone.

I personally do not think he could be much off a guy like Marc Sylvester 1:48 scratch, 1:47.xx relay, who WAS very fast for a HS'er at 400 as well, altho not even this fast from scratch.Or a JJ who Sylvester easily disposed of at AOC.

I mean seriously, Brown may very well touch 45 high on a relay split chasing this year even and go 46.xx probably for sure.

the thing is, at least at this level, that if you can go so low on the 400 side and have shown you can already go 1:17.xx as a junior and all this is indoors.

That:

I think 46.5 and 1:52 somewhere , a split, scratch, no matter ,is in his future by June.


As great minds say, we shall see, they will run what they run.

[dwacox]

Scotty has it right, of course.





I think 46.5 and 1:52 somewhere , a split, scratch, no matter ,is in his future by June.


As great minds say, we shall see, they will run what they run.

Once again King the prophet S Brown splits 20.xx and 46.2 today

[scott c]

Once again King the profit S Brown splits 20.xx and 46.2 today

King is making a profit off Brown? ;)

[dwacox]

King is making a profit off Brown? ;)
whoops I will change it

[scott c]

All kidding aside, that's a sweet day. Was that 200 split on 4x200 or SMR? and what did the team end up running?

[dwacox]

All kidding aside, that's a sweet day. Was that 200 split on 4x200 or SMR? and what did the team end up running?

it was a 4x200 they ended yp in 3rd 132xx I believe but it was a nice race as shaq and Kevin thompson from north bergen got the stick together with shaq openning up about 5 meters on Kevin

[Scotty]

Is that 46.2 accurate DC? WOW!

[dwacox]

Is that 46.2 accurate DC? WOW!

it was confirmed by 5 watches all who had 46.1 or 46.2

[runinstripes]

Is that 46.2 accurate DC? WOW!
As accurate as possible from someone with a slightly biased finger! ;)

[dwacox]

As accurate as possible from someone with a slightly biased finger! ;)
darn you figured out who had the 46.1 :D

[king99]

I am not one for validity of 200M running start in or out of zone splits..but 400' s are easy to get..like I said..it;s only a matter of time until he splits 45.xx , and now it appears sooner than later.

If you guys have not seen this guy in person..wait until you do..he IS THAT good!!

And for those who think he should not move up..I say why the heck not..he can carry 46.xx speed easily and fluidly, he will be the next great 400/800 star from NJ

he is big strong and FAST anyone remember Juantorena.?.I know that sounds nuts but I have not seen someone who can be this good in years

[dwacox]

I am not one for validity of 200M running start in or out of zone splits..but 400' s are easy to get..like I said..it;s only a matter of time until he splits 45.xx , and now it appears sooner than later.

If you guys have not seen this guy in person..wait until you do..he IS THAT good!!

And for those who think he should not move up..I say why the heck not..he can carry 46.xx speed easily and fluidly, he will be the next great 400/800 star from NJ

he is big strong and FAST anyone remember Juantorena.?.I know that sounds nuts but I have not seen someone who can be this good in years

wow el cabello high praise indeed

[Joe Lanzalotto]

And for those who think he should not move up..I say why the heck not..he can carry 46.xx speed easily and fluidly, he will be the next great 400/800 star from NJ

he is big strong and FAST anyone remember Juantorena.?.I know that sounds nuts but I have not seen someone who can be this good in years

I think he should not "move up" ...yet. Hell, he can do both at once, but with that kind of speed, I say let him focus and go further with the 200 and the 400.

And BTW, people thought I was nuts for being just curious to see if he could run 45 point this year. I can't wait to see what they make of your implication about Juantorena!:D

[king99]

Me neither, but for those who have not seen him, do not be quick to judge, I thought your 45.xx prediction was agressive, every week this guy gets better and stronger,I put zero past him now!!

[78Champ]

Dwayne,

I just think it is fair to point out that the 200 split was very wind aided. But he absolutely did open up a good distance on a very good K. Thompson. Just wish those two and Jamar Cotton had gotten the stick all together. That would have been something.

I left before the 400 leg, but if the wind was still blowing like it was earlier, this is even more impressive than the 200 split. The wind on the back stretch hurt much more than it helped on the front in my opinion.

JW

[Scotty]

Just want to correct myself. Shaq Brown ran 47.67 last year

not 47.53 as I posted earlier.

DC, has he ever broken 22.00 scratch? If not, it will certainly happen next time out.

[78Champ]

DC, has he ever broken 22.00 scratch? If not, it will certainly happen next time out.

No doubt about that, with an improved start.

JW

[dwacox]

Dwayne,

I just think it is fair to point out that the 200 split was very wind aided. But he absolutely did open up a good distance on a very good K. Thompson. Just wish those two and Jamar Cotton had gotten the stick all together. That would have been something.

I left before the 400 leg, but if the wind was still blowing like it was earlier, this is even more impressive than the 200 split. The wind on the back stretch hurt much more than it helped on the front in my opinion.

JW

fair pont I debated whether to post about the wind but of couse my post would have been about the head wind he faced in the 400 :D

[dwacox]

Just want to correct myself. Shaq Brown ran 47.67 last year

not 47.53 as I posted earlier.

DC, has he ever broken 22.00 scratch? If not, it will certainly happen next time out.
I believe 22.0h at last years sectionals was his pr

I stand corrected I forgot he ran 21.7h when he beat M Garvin in a dual meet earlier this year

[Kalaby]

I'm not going to enter the debate regarding the merits of XC training for SB etc, but I am wondering when will the Obea Moore comparisons begin in earnest if and when he takes some serious cracks at the 800? As a high school all-timer by anybody's definition Moore had PRs of 20.77/45.14/1:49.16.

[Joe Lanzalotto]

fair pont I debated whether to post about the wind but of couse my post would have been about the head wind he faced in the 400 :D

But has he ever run at Van Coutland?:D

[78Champ]

I'm not going to enter the debate regarding the merits of XC training for SB etc, but I am wondering when will the Obea Moore comparisons begin in earnest if and when he takes some serious cracks at the 800? As a high school all-timer by anybody's definition Moore had PRs of 20.77/45.14/1:49.16.

My best guess is sometime around 11:17AM EDT on April 17, 2005.

JW

(BTW, whatever happened to Obea? :p )

[Kalaby]

My best guess is sometime around 11:17AM EDT on April 17, 2005.

JW

(BTW, whatever happened to Obea? :p )

LOL!

As you know, Obea is probably in the middle of his 20th "comeback" right now.

All joking aside, I do not know SB as well as some of you NJ followers, but the kid is obviously an immense talent. I'd love to see what he can do with some training geared towards the 800.

[Kniteryder]

Well although he prolly can run a good 800m, I think he should still make the shorter events his prowess! I just think he is a long sprinter who happens to be able to run a good 800m, I don't think that he should move up cuz everyone wants him to move up.

[tach44444]

I just think he is a long sprinter who happens to be able to run a good 800m

and what has the 800 become other than a long sprint? the best are running 50-52 seconds per lap for 2 laps. if a 51 isn't an all out sprint for these guys, it sure isn't a comfortable pace. it takes enough out of them where it would be considered a sprint, thus making it a long sprint.

[RBroady]

the best are running 50-52 seconds per lap for 2 laps.

whos running 1:40-1:44? haha

[78Champ]

Well although he prolly can run a good 800m, I think he should still make the shorter events his prowess! I just think he is a long sprinter who happens to be able to run a good 800m, I don't think that he should move up cuz everyone wants him to move up.

The people around him know a little about the sport. If they think he should move up, he will.

JW

[Kniteryder]

The people around him know a little about the sport. If they think he should move up, he will.

JW


Why do u think u would have to state that, obviously that is something they would know if the kid is running 47.7/1:17.9HT(1:18A) indoor...are u slighting them?? or u speaking about people on the boards(not sure if his coach posts on thsi board???)

I would just hate though when he does make a run at a serious 800m and he doesn;t run what most of you guys expect, that you guys won't slay him...

[MaestroXC]

Knite, don't worry about it. You and JW are on the same page with this.

[78Champ]

Why do u think u would have to state that, obviously that is something they would know if the kid is running 47.7/1:17.9HT(1:18A) indoor...are u slighting them?? or u speaking about people on the boards(not sure if his coach posts on thsi board???)

I would just hate though when he does make a run at a serious 800m and he doesn;t run what most of you guys expect, that you guys won't slay him...

My post was in response to you (that would be why I quoted you):

Well although he prolly can run a good 800m, I think he should still make the shorter events his prowess! I just think he is a long sprinter who happens to be able to run a good 800m, I don't think that he should move up cuz everyone wants him to move up.

You "don't think that he should move up cuz everyone wants him to", but in the same post you state "I think he should still make the shorter events his prowess". Just odd I thought.

The coaches around him are very experienced and have had success across a number of events. They will handle him properly, so it really does not matter what everybody thinks. Does not mean the subject can't be discussed and opinions shared.

JW

[king99]

First of all, I do not quite undestand, why anyone on here thinks any one of us has any influenece in the Brown issues.

That's number one.

Number two, why the resistance to wanting to see what he can do at 800? That I do not get.

Some folkd need to really get a grip here. Even if the wonderfully talented Brown runs 46.xx scratch this year and even 45.xx next year, like it or not 45.xx guys at next level are a dime a dozen.

1:45 guys in our country unfortunately are NOT anymore.

I have seen Brown run, he is fast enough to run competitive 400's for as long as he likes, but his ease of 1:17 .xx with no doubt 1:16.xx to follow, next year, would lead any logical person to belive that he CAN or COULD run under 1:50 with only a moderate amount of over distance stuff.

heck he can now get by in 1:20 flat easily, that should be a no brainer to anyone, and off his 46.2 split if he went back in time a coupel months and ran 600 again he could easily get by in 50.xx and keep on running .

The prospects or thoughts of what he could do at 800 are mind boggling,

We have alll seen a 46.xx guy, not many of us or guys on here have seen 1:48.5 HS guys, some have but ceratinly NOT the younger generation.

[Kniteryder]

My post was in response to you (that would be why I quoted you):



You "don't think that he should move up cuz everyone wants him to", but in the same post you state "I think he should still make the shorter events his prowess". Just odd I thought.

The coaches around him are very experienced and have had success across a number of events. They will handle him properly, so it really does not matter what everybody thinks. Does not mean the subject can't be discussed and opinions shared.

JW

I said that because everyone will just look at what he does in other events and just says he will run this or that, and I'd rather see the concerted effort so that when/if he does run the event he won't get bombed by dyestaters who will say ..."He should have ran this" or "He ran poorly"...but yes I said He should stick with the shorter events until he is ready for that jump.

I am for the kid running anything he wants, but not for the bashing that comes with not performing well on this board that's all. Obviosuly he has the talent to run the 200 thru 800...with that said, there have been numerous threads about him running the 800 without regard to the fact he is a 200/400 guy right now. For the record, not once did I not say that anyone cannot share their opinions...if that is what u read, I don't see it where it was written...but this is my opinion so I wouldn't be able to say that...

Finally u guys, C'mon....we know how the dyestat faithful can bash some of these kids...

THe kids a monster and I want to see him at his best...BTW, when will we see a Brown vs. McCombs encounter in that 400m or 4x4 relay?? ANyone....thx

[Kniteryder]

First of all, I do not quite undestand, why anyone on here thinks any one of us has any influenece in the Brown issues.

That's number one.

Number two, why the resistance to wanting to see what he can do at 800? That I do not get.

Some folkd need to really get a grip here. Even if the wonderfully talented Brown runs 46.xx scratch this year and even 45.xx next year, like it or not 45.xx guys at next level are a dime a dozen.

1:45 guys in our country unfortunately are NOT anymore.

I have seen Brown run, he is fast enough to run competitive 400's for as long as he likes, but his ease of 1:17 .xx with no doubt 1:16.xx to follow, next year, would lead any logical person to belive that he CAN or COULD run under 1:50 with only a moderate amount of over distance stuff.

heck he can now get by in 1:20 flat easily, that should be a no brainer to anyone, and off his 46.2 split if he went back in time a coupel months and ran 600 again he could easily get by in 50.xx and keep on running .

The prospects or thoughts of what he could do at 800 are mind boggling,

We have alll seen a 46.xx guy, not many of us or guys on here have seen 1:48.5 HS guys, some have but ceratinly NOT the younger generation.


Who would need to get a grip..??? I see no anger being thrown in this discussion, I see people make a lot of inferred assumptions of what people think, but not any anger...and I responded so that u can understand where I was coming from...see post above...but certainly I hope the best for the kid at any event. Finally...I hope no one on this board has that major of an influence on him if that is the case...I hope he doesn't read the boards quite honestly. Some of the things people say about these kids is non-sympathetic...for a 16/17 or even 18 yr old.

But if he does...Brown, whatever u run...GOOD LUCK & WISH U THE BEST!!!
;)

[Kniteryder]

Knite, don't worry about it. You and JW are on the same page with this.


I believe so, but sometimes people like to spur things on, with this message board, when the intended direction of people's thoughts being taken to a different level/meaning...THX!

;)

[king99]

Kniteryder,?? a little defensive here aren;t we? Who mentioned anger or said anything WITH anger? at all?

Not sure i get where that's coiming from

[reyp]

Shaq is just starting to open up to the idea of running the 800.He is not different then most fottball players who just want to run speed events, but he is realizing how much talent he has in the 800 but i still believe is gonna be hard for him to give up on the 200 or not run it ass much cause he likes just as much as he likes the 400.

[reyp]

knityrider

i dont believe they meet up until group IV down at egg harbor, well unless old bridge runs at berdnerville(?).Plus maybe at penns in the 4by400.

[78Champ]

I believe so, but sometimes people like to spur things on, with this message board, when the intended direction of people's thoughts being taken to a different level/meaning...THX!

;)

Reading your additional posts I agree that we are pretty much on the same page here. But like I said, that paragraph in your first post struck me as a little contradictory. That was all.

JW

[tach44444]

Here is a post from tach44444 from another running board just to show his maturity!

i tackled a group of 3 sixth grade girls in one lunge becasue they were talking smack to me. got chased by 7 arabic teens for giving them the finger, and almost got caught. tackled this really gangster kid to the cement wen he said "run forrest run". stole this kids jacket and skateboard and threw them into a nearby lake for talking smack. yea i don't usually allow kids to talk s*** to me.

i'm glad to see atleast u take time out of ur busy schedule to follow my work. i assume u've read more of my posts on that site, and i feel they are quite insiteful. i can send you more of my literary work if u r up to it, cuz i fancy i have a solid descriptive ability as well as a way with words that makes my english papers oo so very readable, or so i'd like to think.

as for the maturity, i have the rest of my life to be mature and responsible, being 16, i try to take a Laissez-faire approach to life, passively enjoying my youth. if u have a qualm about my out take on life, send me message or watever, and we'll talk about it. ;)

[tach44444]

knityrider

i dont believe they meet up until group IV down at egg harbor, well unless old bridge runs at berdnerville(?).Plus maybe at penns in the 4by400.

bernard's invitational? may 7th.

[runinstripes]

Wow 97 posts on one person....that has to be a record for the NJ board!!

[PFFlyer]

I believe so, but sometimes people like to spur things on, with this message board, when the intended direction of people's thoughts being taken to a different level/meaning...THX!
;)

Huh?

[reyp]

Wow 97 posts on one person....that has to be a record for the NJ board!!
not really, i believe we had one bout moe's age and another about moe not running at van cortland that were much longer then this one.

[tach44444]

Wow 97 posts on one person....that has to be a record for the NJ board!!

plus the whole thread isn't totally about S.B.. It diverges into varied subjects or arguments so i say.

[MaestroXC]

not really, i believe we had one bout moe's age and another about moe not running at van cortland that were much longer then this one.

This thread holds the record for the newly resurfaced, faster Dyestat Forum. On the old forum, this would be a 75 post thread; good, but no All-Timer.

;)

[dwacox]

Just to be the 100th poster on this thread :D

Shaquan goes 21.3 at a dual meet today at bergen catholic (300 meter track)

[Kalaby]

This thread holds the record for the newly resurfaced, faster Dyestat Forum. On the old forum, this would be a 75 post thread; good, but no All-Timer.

;)


LOL - Good one!

[Joe Lanzalotto]

Just to be the 100th poster on this thread :D

Shaquan goes 21.3 at a dual meet today at bergen catholic (300 meter track)

Dwayne, what is the track surface there?

[dwacox]

Dwayne, what is the track surface there?
all weather

[jersey_guy]

Dwayne

I was an official at that meet and I don't know what surface it was exactly. It's definitely too hard to be Mondo type. It looked/felt like rubberized blacktop. By the way, what were his times in 100 and 400? I assume you beat BC? And did Kennedy girls beat IHA?

PS It's more like 315m long (just over 5 laps to the mile). Most confusing track ever.

[reyp]

he said about 10.6 or 10.7 in the 100 and he said 48.** for the 400. kennedy boys beat both bc and montclair. Kennedy girls took to tought L's today the montclair one being real close one.

QUOTE=jersey_guy]Dwayne

I was an official at that meet and I don't know what surface it was exactly. It's definitely too hard to be Mondo type. It looked/felt like rubberized blacktop. By the way, what were his times in 100 and 400? I assume you beat BC? And did Kennedy girls beat IHA?

PS It's more like 315m long (just over 5 laps to the mile). Most confusing track ever.[/QUOTE]

[Shep]

GO MOUNTIES!!

[ajd2run]

Dwayne

I was an official at that meet and I don't know what surface it was exactly. It's definitely too hard to be Mondo type. It looked/felt like rubberized blacktop. By the way, what were his times in 100 and 400? I assume you beat BC? And did Kennedy girls beat IHA?

PS It's more like 315m long (just over 5 laps to the mile). Most confusing track ever.

mondo surface is very hard... it's only a thin layer of "mondo" carpet on concrete. contrete is harder than black top.