Best Athlete in the State

[MikeGamms]

If you were to vote for a most outstanding athlete or MVP of nys, who would it be and why? any event at all.

my vote's for gary jones, ranked number 1 in the nation.. won 2 state titles and 1 national title in indoor. impressive stuff.

what does every one else think??

PLEASE BE HONEST AND VOTE FOR 1 GIRL AND 1 GUY

[gofast11]

It would have to be either Jones or Henning. they have the best marks relative to all other competitiors in the nation. Kelsey has a great mark in the steeplechase but remember that event is not contested in many states and it is nowhere near the national record

[toetheline]

for the girls

Lynne Layne from New Rochelle

Lindsey Ferguson from Saratoga - steeplechase

Aislinn Ryan

[sub5miler]

i def think mike mark is the best all-around athlete in nys. He runs a 151 800, 5th at xc states, 49.x 400, 420 mile, 940's in the 2mile, and does well in events like the long jump. If ur lookin for someone that has some serious talents and great range then hes def ur guy.

[runningforthegold]

i def think mike mark is the best all-around athlete in nys. He runs a 151 800, 5th at xc states, 49.x 400, 420 mile, 940's in the 2mile, and does well in events like the long jump. If ur lookin for someone that has some serious talents and great range then hes def ur guy.


You are really crazy. Lindsey Ferguson is the national record holder. Henning has the national class record. Ryan won the Footlocker national championships and has medalled in individual events at the nationals.

Mark is well rounded but not at this time elite at the national level in anything

[Achilles]

i def think mike mark is the best all-around athlete in nys. He runs a 151 800, 5th at xc states, 49.x 400, 420 mile, 940's in the 2mile, and does well in events like the long jump. If ur lookin for someone that has some serious talents and great range then hes def ur guy.

Well rhodes devey has run 1:52.2 open last year, 49 point splits, 4:13 mile (4:09 low split) 9:11-12 two mile (from his indoor 3k) and he WON states in cross and feds and made nats.

[NYrunner]

If you were to vote for a most outstanding athlete or MVP of nys, who would it be and why? any event at all.

my vote's for gary jones, ranked number 1 in the nation.. won 2 state titles and 1 national title in indoor. impressive stuff.

what does every one else think??
no question on #1....Jones: 23' 5 LJ state champ, 50' 7 triple jump(USA#1 after posting USA #1 indoor triple jump) and can run 22.0/200 and HJ over 6'0.....There is prob. more he can do but I have limited results to work from....This kid is like the Lebron James of HS track. He is just too big and athletic for HS kids to compete with.....

[Shen Rules]

no question on #1....Jones: 23' 5 LJ state champ, 50' 7 triple jump(USA#1 after posting USA #1 indoor triple jump) and can run 22.0/200 and HJ over 6'0.....There is prob. more he can do but I have limited results to work from....This kid is like the Lebron James of HS track. He is just too big and athletic for HS kids to compete with.....


Walter Henning definately puts question to that #1...
How many national records does Jones have? Henning has 2(maybe more?) National titles just this indoor.

[Shen Rules]

no question on #1....Jones: 23' 5 LJ state champ, 50' 7 triple jump(USA#1 after posting USA #1 indoor triple jump) and can run 22.0/200 and HJ over 6'0.....There is prob. more he can do but I have limited results to work from....This kid is like the Lebron James of HS track. He is just too big and athletic for HS kids to compete with.....


By the way, TX will probably have 3 guys with similar credentials by the end of their outdoor season.

[backtoback]

the question was best "athlete". that to me means well rounded and does many "different" things. not just distance events, or sprint events, or field events. i think sub5miler read the question correctly, whether or not you agree with him or disagree is fine. but it's best athlete, not best at 1 event or events of similar nature.

[runningforthegold]

the question was best "athlete". that to me means well rounded and does many "different" things. not just distance events, or sprint events, or field events. i think sub5miler read the question correctly, whether or not you agree with him or disagree is fine. but it's best athlete, not best at 1 event or events of similar nature.

In track and field being well rounded does not make you the best athlete. The best athlete is the one who has the greatest accomplishments in the event they chose to participate in. In baseball they have a term for your selection. they call them utility players. They can play many positions but are certainly not all stars.

[NYrunner]

By the way, TX will probably have 3 guys with similar credentials by the end of their outdoor season.
Texas is not really cosidered part of NYS though.....What events does Henning star in? If a racewalker breaks a bunch of national records would they have your vote for best athlete?

[Jew]

no question on #1....Jones: 23' 5 LJ state champ, 50' 7 triple jump(USA#1 after posting USA #1 indoor triple jump) and can run 22.0/200 and HJ over 6'0.....There is prob. more he can do but I have limited results to work from....This kid is like the Lebron James of HS track. He is just too big and athletic for HS kids to compete with.....


Isn't he also a rly good football player?

[PG400]

Mark is well rounded but not at this time elite at the national level in anything

Mark had the fastest 800 split in the country this indoor season with a 1:51.5 split. He won a state title, national title, and is (i think) a 3 time all american. So saying he's not national level just doesn't make any sense. He is a well rounded athlete and can do anything from a 400 to long jump, to a 5k and do crazy. Sure there are better people at individual events but if youre looking for the best athlete (which i think means the best times at a number of differnt events) Mark FTW.

[runningforthegold]

Remember, a very significant part of the country does not participate in indoor track. Lets see where he stands on the Dyestat leaderboard in any of the events he participates in this spring to find out how good he really is.

[backtoback]

1:51.5 is 1:51.5 indoors or out, its still 800m. however you wouldnt even see that time on a leaderboard list b/c it was a carry b/c all he ever really does are the relays... i do not know who i would vote for in nys. just throwing this name out there but doesn't kippins run 1:56, triple jump insanely and play a nasty soccer game?

[MikeGamms]

i know this is slightly off topic, but all the conversation about being well rounded and stuff made me think of joe greene. if i had asked this qeustion a year a go, he would be my choice. kid won states inthe 400 and long jump. was runner up indoors in the 6, and also competed in the 55 hurdles there. he could compete in any event 55-1600 and run very well, plus both hurdles and jumps. if this kid ever did pentathlon last year he would of been disgusting. (he started running 400 hurdles now his fr. year at ablany and ran 51.87 at penn relays.. gross)


but for this year is still jones! (go section v!)

[Canned Food]

steeple chase is the event kids do when they arent good enough at the 1600 or 3200. its a cop out. calling lindsey furgerson the best in the state becuase of her steeple credentials is a joke, girls steeple has been around for like 6 years.

[runningforthegold]

1:51.5 is 1:51.5 indoors or out, its still 800m. however you wouldnt even see that time on a leaderboard list b/c it was a carry b/c all he ever really does are the relays... i do not know who i would vote for in nys. just throwing this name out there but doesn't kippins run 1:56, triple jump insanely and play a nasty soccer game?


I am having trouble finding that 1:51 right now that you talked about. Maybe it has become lost in smoke and haze. Probably the residue of the fire under Lionel Williams spikes last weekend at Franklin Field

[backtoback]

i will not knock lionel he's got the goods

[boon322]

I am having trouble finding that 1:51 right now that you talked about. Maybe it has become lost in smoke and haze. Probably the residue of the fire under Lionel Williams spikes last weekend at Franklin Field

What's with the disrespect?

The man was stating his opinion, which is that HE THINKS Mike Mark is the most well rounded/best athlete in NYS. He wasn't stating that you thought that, or that anybody else thought that.

Mark's 1:51 was legit... the splits for Warwicks SMR that day were reported as something like 23.9, 22.9, 48.4, 1:51.5

Mark may not have run a 1:51 at Penn Relays this past weekend, but I don't believe he has split slower than a 1:55 since before nationals last year during outdoor in any race. He is a very talented 800m runner, no argument.

Lionel Williams is crazy. To split 1:51 twice in a row on back to back days is incredible... nobody's arguing there. I'm also pretty sure that Williams would not want people coming on here flaunting his times just to shut down other athletes. He's an incredible athlete, and you may think he's the best in NYS, but thats a matter of opinion, just like backtoback thinks Mike Mark is the best.

There is no possible way that somebody can say Mike Mark is not a good athlete, you can't even put up a good argument about him not being a top level athlete. Maybe you don't believe he's the best, but backtoback obviously does, and all he was doing was stating his opinion.

Neither backtoback or Mike Mark deserve your disrespect. [/RANT]


I think voting for the best athlete in NYS is a very difficult task, but my vote would probably go to one of the DiCesare's. (I think I spelt their name wrong though) I got to witness their domination over the Decathlon at the Empire State Games last year and flat out, I'd say they are some of the best athletes in the state being they can run, throw, jump, and vault with the best in many events.

[gothedistance]

In track and field being well rounded does not make you the best athlete. The best athlete is the one who has the greatest accomplishments in the event they chose to participate in. In baseball they have a term for your selection. they call them utility players. They can play many positions but are certainly not all stars.


On the girls side, Lynne Layne is exceptional, but what lists is she on, the 100, 200 & LJ, I looked at the rankings, she's not even on the 400, Christie Verdier, a Soph from Baldwin is in the 100 (12.2), 200 (24.8), & 400 (57.3) I heard she ran 55 point split at Penn, Maegan Krifchin from JFK Bellmore is ranked in the 200 (25.7), 400 (58.9), 800 (2:16) (has run 2:10), 1500 (4:38), mile (4:59), & 5000 (17:52) (now that's well rounded), Ashley Hendrix from Uniondale was state champ in the high hurdles last year & Long Jumps over 19', runs 57 point. For boys, Hennings can run as well as throw, he just does not compete in running anymore because his thros have come so far. It is always hard to compare athlets in different events, how can anyone say who is better, on any given day things can change. Nont many field kids are great runners, but sprinters can jump much of the time. Distance runners do not usually show up in sprint events (Krifchin may be the only exception ever) Sheffey can to, but I've never seen a 200 time from her, but she runs 58 point & was a state titles in the 800 up to XC

Gary Jones is awesome, I mean lets get real 50' in the Triple in High School - does not happen often

[MikeGamms]

i hate to keep brinign up the same kid but i'm going to anyways haha.

all of you have all mentioned different mid distance or distance runners. the fact that there are many arguements for who is the best mid/distance runner makes me believe that there is no clear cut top guy in that area.

but no one questions jones as the best jump in the state. i think that says alot, he is easily the best at what he does. which i think makes him the best.

[NYrunner]

You can not just list people ranked very high in the nation or state in one event as great "track athletes". During the 1990s Olympics Dan and Dave were decath guys who many considered the best all-around athletes in the world even though they were not elite in any one event. Without question the best track athlete is someone who can do track AND field events. People like Gary Jones are so crazy good at certain events that he doesn't have the time to try the 400 or the hurdles or throws but any one who has seen this "kid" knows he would kick butt in any of these events if he spent just a small time training for them. This kid could be a TE for a college football team in the fall and than an all american track athlete in the winter/spring.

I am a distance runner and care little for the jumps/sprints but I can not see how you could put anyone, excluding all the great Texas athletes of course, a head of Jones with regard to athletic ability. If you try than you have not seen Gary compete.

[backtoback]

boon, i never said he was the best athlete. sub5miler did. I however said I do not know who i would vote for.

[BrandNewHero106]

Lynne Layne split :55 indoors at the Armory for New Rochelle's 4x400 Millrose trials. Also, while she may not be on the leaderboards for the 800 or 1500, she is the best in the state, and one of the best in the nation, at the events she does run. She won indoor states in the 55m, won states long jump, set the Armory HS record at the 55m at eastern states indoors, won 100m and 200m at states last spring along with 55m indoors. Did I mention she also had the best 55mHH time in the state this past winter? She was also one of the top in the nation in 55m, 200m, and LJ indoors. Plus a :55 split isn't too bad either.
Lynne Layne is not only exceptional, but also has depth, versatility, and range as well. She could very easily be the best track/field athlete in NYS.


As for Mike Mark, he is no doubt an incredible athlete, but I would probably say that overall BRD tops him, and possibly even Bean as well.
BRD ran 1:52.25 as a Sophomore, and had his incredible 4:09 1600 split. Not to mention that he ran his 8:31 3k (roughly 9:08-9 for the 3200). Along with this, he won XC States, Feds, and qualified for FL Nationals. As for Bean, he split 1:52 last spring (and I think split 1:52 again this indoor season, along with a number of other 1:53s and 1:54s), just ran 4:14 for the full open mile, barely missing the win at Penn, and also had an extraordinary cross country season, coming in 21st (8th from NY) at Foot Locker. He could be a ridiculous 2miler as well, but he hasn't really run an all out 3200 in a while.
Also, Kelsey is a 4:14 miler and 9:12 3200 runner, as well as qualifying for FL nats. The fact that he's one of the top steeplers NYS has ever seen, and could quite possibly be the best in the nation come the end of the season doesn't hurt (even if some people don't think that steeple is a legit event.)



Edit: Also the DiCesares are amazing. Top PVers in the state, and als incredible at TJ and LJ. Both also have incredible speed. The two could be the best pentathletes (/decathletes) in the state. They're so versatile it's ridiculous.

[KG]

steeple chase is the event kids do when they arent good enough at the 1600 or 3200. its a cop out. calling lindsey furgerson the best in the state becuase of her steeple credentials is a joke, girls steeple has been around for like 6 years.

Steeple isn't a cop out. Lindsey would do just as well if she ran flat races...which she does and is one of the best in the nation. Steeple requires distance speed + hurdling ability + the ability to change the pace quickly + toughness. Not something that a lot of girls or guys have

[Kalaby]

steeple chase is the event kids do when they arent good enough at the 1600 or 3200. its a cop out.

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt because I think I understand the point you are trying to make, however, your choice of words leaves a lot to be desired. The steeple is a very difficult event and is certainly not a cop out, to the contrary, I respect all the kids that step up to the plate and run it.

[TrAcKoPuNeK]

Steeple isn't a cop out. Lindsey would do just as well if she ran flat races...which she does and is one of the best in the nation. Steeple requires distance speed + hurdling ability + the ability to change the pace quickly + toughness. Not something that a lot of girls or guys have

But the fact of the matter is, her "national record" is not quite the record that flat event national, even NY state records are. The reason she got into steeple to begin with was probably because she wasnt even the best 3k runner on her team and she could win states in the steeple with blood winning the 3k. She is a great athlete, but if you put Blood in the steeple she probably would have beaten Ferguson and this is probably true of about 15-20 females in the country right now (Ryan, Lawrence, St.Geme, Hassay, Bies ect.)

[luv2run4fun]

I've got to say Kara McKenna because she has so much depth. She's broken 60 in the 400, and correct me if I'm wrong but someone told me she went sub 59 also on a relay? She's split 2:11 in the 800 at NSIC this year and last year at warwick relays, has run a 4:54 mile at hispanic games and won, split 4:51 for the 1600 on her team's NSIC DMR national championship, qualified for Millrose 2 times and Boston Invitational, has run 1:36 in the 600 at the Stanner Games two years in a row, ran a 9:58 3000 (a section 1 record where the 2nd place finisher was nearly 30 seconds back), run a 2:52 1000, a section 1 record where she won by 5 seconds after running a 3000 20 minutes before that. Has also run a 4:35 1500, won states in the 1500 and her 4X800 team won states and went sub-9 at NSIC, and she was one place away from qualifying for FL nats. Has been one of the top steeplechasers in the state and nation, and has been all-state since her frosh year and an all-american since her sophmore year. No doubt one of the best runners in the nation.

[runtough]

Agreeing with luv2run , McKenna is also one of the best steeplers in the nation ls well.

[MikeGamms]

i added a poll, but please only pick 1 girland 1 guy to try and make it more legit

[Callipygious]

Walter is lucky BRD likes running.

[remiks]

Layne and Jones. Even outside of track, I know Layne really excelled in soccer, I wonder if she'll play in college at all.

[donald5370]

Mark is well rounded but not at this time elite at the national level in anything

from a meet @ warwick tonight

mark takes the 800 in 151.8 and splits 48.8 on a 4x4 relay

[PG400]

Mark ran the US #2 in 1:50.98. This guys legit.

[sprinter200]

Mike Mark all the way

[jusarunner]

1:50.98 :eek:

[MikeGamms]

i'll be impressed if he runs in the 40s. i have seen plenty of 1:50's atleast 1 every year in NY recently. (craddock, luka) it is a fairly normal thing.

[Machine]

Walter Henning was the best hammerthrower in the world for a 16 year old last year... he threw farther than anyone in the whole world... all the athletes on the list is great, however i don't think they could top Walter Henning's success.

[MikeGamms]

Hammer Throw isnt contested every where.. it isnt a state even event in this state i dont think..

[Dr. Kenneth Noisewater]

Mike Kippins from Shaker gets my vote:

(rough estimates)
200-23
400-sub 50
800-155
LJ-22
TJ-46
HJ-6'4
110HH-15 low
440IH-55.

[king zora]

after last nights 150.8 open and 49. ..


mike mark takes the cake

[LifetimeRun]

They're catching on:

Allison Sawyer (Hilton) sets Section 5 Steeplechase record (6:54.15). Not sure how old this girl is, but that's a pretty solid time.

Can't wait to see what McKenna can do this year as a senior.

[luv2run4fun]

They're catching on:

Allison Sawyer (Hilton) sets Section 5 Steeplechase record (6:54.15). Not sure how old this girl is, but that's a pretty solid time.

she's a junior and

Can't wait to see what McKenna can do this year as a senior.

me too. There's no doubt she'll get even closer to ferguson this year, I wouldn't be surprised if at states and nats it comes down to a sprint for the titles between them.

[Erik van Ingen]

I picked BRD because he's extremely competitive across the board whether it's an 800 or a 5k

[sprinter200]

well if ur gonna say shakers kippins u might as well go with warwicks pat gallagher

200-22.3
400-48.4
800- 1:53
lj- 20+
tj-39 ish +

[BrandNewHero106]

well if ur gonna say shakers kippins u might as well go with warwicks pat gallagher

200-22.3
400-48.4
800- 1:53
lj- 20+
tj-39 ish +


While gallagher's running times are slightly faster, what makes Kippins incredible are that his LJ and TJ markes are amazing, plus his HJ is ridiculous, and his Hurdle times are crazy as well. There are plenty of sprinters who can also LJ/TJ, but being able to also HJ and Hurdle that well is even more amazing.

[raoul duke]

You guys messed this poll up...the best running 'athlete' in nys is obviously
Donovan Haigler from White Plains… hurdles...triple jump...pentathlon.....he’s a much better 'athlete’; then bean, mckenna, etc

[sprinter200]

:eek: i just realized the diceaser brothers arent on the poll there incredible athletes

[PG400]

You also forgot Karl Schnabl, he ran a sick 100 time last year winning the frosh/soph meet in a blazing 14.2 seconds.

[sprinter200]

You also forgot Karl Schnabl, he ran a sick 100 time last year winning the frosh/soph meet in a blazing 14.2 seconds.
oh man that kid is quick i heard he trained with gatlin over the summer, and sleeps in a altitude, i also heard he was a clan leader on halo 2, i think he'll win nationals this year

[luv2run4fun]

You guys messed this poll up...the best running 'athlete' in nys is obviously
Donovan Haigler from White Plains… hurdles...triple jump...pentathlon.....he’s a much better 'athlete’; then bean, mckenna, etc

you just beat me to mention my own teamate! Donovan is amazing, he's so modest and is so hard-working. He's never done a distance workout in his life and ran a 4:45.xx 1500 at loucks last year in the pentathalon. pretty beastly for a sprinter :D

[MikeGamms]

i am dissapointed that BUMP is not on the list..

[purplewave at NRHS]

When one talks about the best all around athlete you are referring to one that can score in most events. In baseball they play almost all the positions, in football they can be running back, DB, Wide Re, and even QB, all in the same game. What distinquishs the person who is the BEST ATHLETE is the result. Usually the these athletes are threat to score, and help the team in pursuit of it's goals. Lynne Layne fits the bill as best athlete because of her versatility, AND EXCELLENCE IN ANY EVENT SHE DOES. Whether it's the hurdles, long jump, racing she goes for the gusto, and it's usually out on top.
She can do so many other events, as well. Be it the HJ, TJ 400 H, even the 800 which she has run at Dual meets.:)

[MikeGamms]

When one talks about the best all around athlete I am referring to one that can score in most events. In baseball they play almost all the positions, in football they can be running back, DB, Wide Re, and even QB, all in the same game. What distinquishs the person who is the BEST ATHLETE is the result. Usually the these athletes are threat to score, and help the team in pursuit of it's goals. Lynne Layne fits the bill as best athlete because of her versatility, AND EXCELLENCE IN ANY EVENT SHE DOES. Whether it's the hurdles, long jump, racing she goes for the gusto, and it's usually out on top.
She can do so many other events, as well. Be it the HJ, TJ 400 H, even the 800 which she has run at Dual meets.:)

<fixed>

everyone's opinion on what makes an athlete the best athlete is different. quit assuming yours to be the absolute truth.

also.. utility fielders are never the best players in baseball. they are usually the guys who arent good enough to start at any one position so they fill in every wherre when needed.

[Big Slick]

baseball is actually a really bad example to use, since the MVPs are largely based off hitting numbers. Barry Bonds and Albert Pujols arent even close to what Derek Jeter can do in the field, but they are considered much better players because they can hit.

[themanontherun]

No Brittney Sheffey on the list? She seems to always pump out state title after state title every year, she puts out sick times, and I have yet to heat a bad word about her. She has great range, from the longer sprints all the way up to her feats in XC... I really think she should be on that list.

Voted BRD and Jones for boys. BRD has more range than a sniper rifle in Halo, and he is the People's Champion. He does the RUPP. BRD has put up some very impressive performances, and has shown that he can be money under pressure. From what I hear, his training involves just working his ass off a lot, which is more impressive than winning with a lot of talent IMHO (not that he doesn't have that in spades as well). Jones has put up some crazy jumps, I think someone else put it best when they said he is the LeBron James of jumping. This kid is going places, and he is a nice guy as well.

Voted Fergusson and Ryan for girls. Fergusson is pretty much awesome. She has titles, records, team titles, and is very cute. National title and record included there, of course. Plus she steeples, which is badass. Ryan has a national title as well, in XC and one or two indoors as well I think. Does things for the team (see last year's Penn DMR, instead of mile) which is as much a part of being a true athlete than just putting up big marks.

[purplewave at NRHS]

<fixed>

everyone's opinion on what makes an athlete the best athlete is different. quit assuming yours to be the absolute truth.

also.. utility fielders are never the best players in baseball. they are usually the guys who arent good enough to start at any one position so they fill in every wherre when needed.


The utility player has a wide range of skills. Can play anywhere on the field because of their wide range of skills. We are defining the best athlete, and these utility players are recognized for their wide range of skills. An infielder might not make the best outfielder, case in point, Alfonso Soriano. His skills seemingly are suited for the infield. Besides that is also what he prefers. The BEST ATHLETE can do it all, and do it well. Thus they are MOST valuable to a team such as a TRACK and FIELD team. To include a distance runner who has not shown athletic skills in the Field doesn't qualify them as the best athlete, that runner is not scoring in the jumps, hurdles, etc. Perhaps they possess those athlete skills, but for this poll they don't qualify.;) as the best athlete.

[MonWoodrunner]

Mike Mark can win any distance/event, and to me has the best kick i've seen in HS....

If the question was who's the most well rounded athlete like i understood it to be, Mike Mark takes it by a mile.

[hero]

I voted for Mr. Timothy Keegan!

[themanontherun]

Mike Mark can win any distance/event, and to me has the best kick i've seen in HS....

If the question was who's the most well rounded athlete like i understood it to be, Mike Mark takes it by a mile.
Mike Mark vs. BRD in an 800 would be close, and BRD could very well win. Go up to th 3200 or into XC zone, and Mark doesn't hold a candle to BRD.

[PineSol]

Although I voted for BRD, Lionel Williams has the sickest range I've seen. Um winning the 200 (22.57) at Staten Island Champs, the same day that he got second in the 1600 (4:27.05). Thats incredible that a sprinter has so much endurance or a distance runner has so much speed.

[PG400]

What sport does lionel do in the fall?

[Needforspeed3]

Brittney is only a Jr. and she has state titles in X-C winter track and spring track and they still leave her off list as being the best. there is no athlete in the state that has the range from 400m- 5k. 57.400- 2:09, 800m 4:26 1500m 4:48 mile, 2:48 100m, 10:05 3000m? 17:30 5k?

No Brittney Sheffey on the list? She seems to always pump out state title after state title every year, she puts out sick times, and I have yet to heat a bad word about her. She has great range, from the longer sprints all the way up to her feats in XC... I really think she should be on that list.

Voted BRD and Jones for boys. BRD has more range than a sniper rifle in Halo, and he is the People's Champion. He does the RUPP. BRD has put up some very impressive performances, and has shown that he can be money under pressure. From what I hear, his training involves just working his ass off a lot, which is more impressive than winning with a lot of talent IMHO (not that he doesn't have that in spades as well). Jones has put up some crazy jumps, I think someone else put it best when they said he is the LeBron James of jumping. This kid is going places, and he is a nice guy as well.

Voted Fergusson and Ryan for girls. Fergusson is pretty much awesome. She has titles, records, team titles, and is very cute. National title and record included there, of course. Plus she steeples, which is badass. Ryan has a national title as well, in XC and one or two indoors as well I think. Does things for the team (see last year's Penn DMR, instead of mile) which is as much a part of being a true athlete than just putting up big marks.

[king zora]

Mike Mark vs. BRD in an 800 would be close, and BRD could very well win. Go up to th 3200 or into XC zone, and Mark doesn't hold a candle to BRD.


hold a candle? mark was only 10 secs back at xc states and hasnt gotten an opportunity to run a fast 3200

[Needforspeed3]

Brittney is only a Jr. and she has state titles in X-C, winter track and spring track and they still leave her off lists as being the best. there is no athlete in the state that has the range from 400m- 5k. 57.400, 2:09, 800m 4:26 1500m 4:48 mile, 2:48 100m, 10:05 3000m? 17:30 5k?
She shows up at all the big meets and places. lets give her credit:D

[AnchorMan]

im not sure but i think he might do football

he does XC

[themanontherun]

hold a candle? mark was only 10 secs back at xc states and hasnt gotten an opportunity to run a fast 3200
He was 59 seconds behind him at the Federation meet. The average seperation between the two was over half a minute. The State meet was a huge race for Mark, whereas it was business as usual for BRD. If you look at their speed ratings on Tullyrunners, BRD starts out with a 189, and save one race he never goes below 190 again. He imporves ten points to a 199 by the end of the season. Mark on the other starts out at 182, hangs around the mid-180s, peaks out in a big way at the State meet, then falls off at Feds with a 180, lower than his first race of the year. Perhaps "hold a candle to" was a poor choice of words, but don't even try to argue that Mark was even within striking distance of BRD in cross country.

[flynn]

Mike Mark vs. BRD in an 800 would be close, and BRD could very well win. Go up to th 3200 or into XC zone, and Mark doesn't hold a candle to BRD.

u can stop talking forever. mike mark 150.9 winning by a few seconds at a midseason meet to brd 152.x at the state meet. mark has it. xc brd had him by only a litle. 10sec someone said?

and mark lj 20+

[pelican]

obviously, none of you have ever seen brd long jump.

[redshoes]

I once saw BRD pole vault. He made Casey DiCesare cry.

[themanontherun]

u can stop talking forever. mike mark 150.9 winning by a few seconds at a midseason meet to brd 152.25 at the state meet. mark has it. xc brd had him by only a litle. 10sec someone said?

and mark lj 20+
1.35 seconds difference in the 800 is proportionatly less than 10 seconds over a 5k race. And see my post above yours, it was usually a looooot more than 10 seconds. I'll give you the long jump (although the longest I've seen a result for him jump is actually 18 3/4), although I've never seen BRD long jump so I don't know. That was BRD last year. What did Mike Mark run last year in the 800? 1:55, and that was a relay split. Just as someone made the argument that Mark has not run a serious 3200 this season, so has BRD yet to run a serious 800.

[Rhodes-Devey]

this is a pretty silly arguement. mark is asian and i have red hair, therefore we are both minorities and need to stick together. combined, we are the greatest red headed asian to ever step foot on the track / woods / planet.


love,
BRD

[Dr. Kenneth Noisewater]

this is a pretty silly arguement. mark is asian and i have red hair, therefore we are both minorities and need to stick together. combined, we are the greatest red headed asian to ever step foot on the track / woods / planet.


love,
BRD


1/10...weak

[PG400]

i thought it was funny..........10/10
Both are at a genetic disadvantage

[the one and only]

You are really crazy. Lindsey Ferguson is the national record holder. Henning has the national class record. Ryan won the Footlocker national championships and has medalled in individual events at the nationals.

Mark is well rounded but not at this time elite at the national level in anything


......haha he ran 1:50.9 in the 800m

NOT ELITE!?

Who are you?

[BrandNewHero106]

......haha he ran 1:50.9 in the 800m

NOT ELITE!?

Who are you?

Right, because runningforthegold totally didn't post that comment before Mark ran the 1:50.9, let alone long before people started talking about, and even longer before the official results were posted (especially since at least 2-3 different times were given for Mark's performance).
Oh wait, he did. Great job.

[BPearson]

Where is Nicole Blood on this list?

[theNalu]

cause she's 3000 miles away from new york

[themanontherun]

Where is Nicole Blood on this list?
She is a New Yorker, but she is not in New York.

[runningforthegold]

Mike Mark has moved up some in my opinion. However someone who is more than 4 seconds away from the national high school record in the 800 is still not anywhere as good an one who holds a national high school record in any event.

I still like Lindsay Ferguson over him

[themanontherun]

Mike Mark has moved up some in my opinion. However someone who is more than 4 seconds away from the national high school record in the 800 is still not anywhere as good an one who holds a national high school record in any event.

I still like Lindsay Ferguson over him
You can vote for multiple people.

[PG400]

Mike Mark has moved up some in my opinion. However someone who is more than 4 seconds away from the national high school record in the 800 is still not anywhere as good an one who holds a national high school record in any event.

I still like Lindsay Ferguson over him

Yeah Lindsay Ferguson has the Steeplechase record and all, but if you think about it the steeplechase is probably the most watered down of the distance events. I've never seen Nicole Blood, Aislinn Ryan, and Jordan Hasay do steeplechase, and I'm sure if they did, then the record would be different. Comparing a sleeplechase national record to the 800 national record isn't a very accurate comparison because most elite distance runners don't participate. Plus, Michael Granville was a beast and I don't think anyone is ever gonna break his record.

[BrandNewHero106]

Okay, I'm getting kind of sick of all these steeple arguments, so let's set things straight.
Yes, it is true that if "all the good runners" like Nicole Blood, Jordan Hasay, Marie Lawrence, Aislinn Ryan, AJ Acosta, Michael Coe, Craiy Forys, etc. ran the steeplechase, then the national record would be different or something along those lines. Even so, this doesn't make the accomplishments of those who run it any less meaningful. People just say "oh, the steeplechase isn't really run much outside NY and few people run it at all", and think that that means that Ferguson's national record isn't as impressive.
While it's true that Ferguson's 6:36 2000st might not be as impressive as the Mile or 3000 national record, it doesn't mean it isn't amazing. To put it in perspective, last year as a sophomore I ran 10:06 for the 3200, and my best time in the 2000st was 6:37, and I'm not a bad steepler. This isn't an isolated case either, there are handfuls of guys who can run sub 4:40 in the 1600 or close to 10 in the 3200 but still can't run as fast as Lindsay Ferguson in the 2000m steeplechase.
Yes, it may be true that ferguson can't beat blood, ryan, hasay, or others in the "flat races" but her steeple performances are simply incredible, and she should be given more credit for it.

[Canned Food]

the boys stepple chase record is legit... girls is not

[gofast11]

Lets add a little bit of an unbiased approach to this. Lindsay's national record is stronger than both the girls 1-mile and 2-mile records relative to the boys marks. She does trail Kim gallaghers 800 m mark in relative strength however.

Lindsay has the sohomore, junior and senior class records. The senior class record now being the national record. A quick analysis of the girls records relative to the boys at nearby distances revels that Ferguson's record is second only to Kim Gallagher's 800 meter record in terms of strength relative to the boys marks.

Ferguson also ran 3:31.5 last week in the 1500 at a dual meet while the best mark nationallly is the 4:23.5 by St. Geme. Jordan Hasay sports a best of 4:25.32. Being 7-8 seconds faster in the 1500 can in no way suggest that either of these two girls would beat Ferguson in the 2000 stepplechase.

It is possible that they could but so far neither has shown that they possess the necessary ingredients to be a steeplchase champion

Boys Girls

800 1:46.45 2:00.07 112.7947%
1-mile 3:53.43 4:35.24 117.9112%
2-mile 8:36.30 10:01.18 116.4401%
2K-SC 5:43.90 6:36.37 115.2573%

[themanontherun]

Steeple ability vs. total lack of steeple ability will cost a lot more than a second and a half per quarter.

[Canned Food]

Lets add a little bit of an unbiased approach to this. Lindsay's national record is stronger than both the girls 1-mile and 2-mile records relative to the boys marks. She does trail Kim gallaghers 800 m mark in relative strength however.

Lindsay has the sohomore, junior and senior class records. The senior class record now being the national record. A quick analysis of the girls records relative to the boys at nearby distances revels that Ferguson's record is second only to Kim Gallagher's 800 meter record in terms of strength relative to the boys marks.

Ferguson also ran 3:31.5 last week in the 1500 at a dual meet while the best mark nationallly is the 4:23.5 by St. Geme. Jordan Hasay sports a best of 4:25.32. Being 7-8 seconds faster in the 1500 can in no way suggest that either of these two girls would beat Ferguson in the 2000 stepplechase.

It is possible that they could but so far neither has shown that they possess the necessary ingredients to be a steeplchase champion

Boys Girls

800 1:46.45 2:00.07 112.7947%
1-mile 3:53.43 4:35.24 117.9112%
2-mile 8:36.30 10:01.18 116.4401%
2K-SC 5:43.90 6:36.37 115.2573%


good kids dont do steeple... U see acosta doin steeple? coe? forys? brd?dmac?mike mark?

if greg kelsey didnt do the steeple he prob wouldnt make it out of sec2 to goto states.

[themanontherun]

good kids dont do steeple... U see acosta doin steeple? coe? forys? brd?dmac?mike mark?

if greg kelsey didnt do the steeple he prob wouldnt make it out of sec2 to goto states.
Kelesy was runner up at the indoor state meet in the 3200, you idiot.

[themanontherun]

Last year, the steeple at NON for guys included two guys who were footlocker finalists that year, and two more who were finalists this year. It's obviously less than the mile or two mile, but that is still a quality field.

[BrandNewHero106]

good kids dont do steeple... U see acosta doin steeple? coe? forys? brd?dmac?mike mark?

if greg kelsey didnt do the steeple he prob wouldnt make it out of sec2 to goto states.

Seriously, what's up with comments like this. Kelsey had the second fastest 3200 time in the state indoors (and just barely behind BRD's 3k conversion) which he ran twice, one of which was on a square track. Also, he ran 4:14 in the mile indoors (compared to BRD's 4:13), and even beat BRD in I believe 3 of their 5 open races against each other (their two 3200s and Millrose vs. BIG and Hispanic- it's even 3-3 if you count the Yale DMR 1200).
And what makes you think that Mike Mark could come close to Kelsey in any event above 800m?
Not to mention that two of the 3 NY FL finalists (Bateman and Kelsey) also happened to be Steeplechasers and lost only to the Taye brothers at FLNE (beating BRD, Koloseus, Capecci, Ward, Massam, Forys, etc.).

I'm not making Kelsey or any of the other steeplers out to be Gods, I'm just saying that just because they may not be at the very top of the nation in the "flat" events, it doesn't make their accomplishments in the steeple any less incredible. If you think that Forys, Coe, DMac, Mike Mark, etc. could beat Kelsey, Bateman, or Lewis head to head in a steeplechase race then you don't know what you're talking about. I'm not saying it wouldn't be close, but steeplechase takes specific training and certain abilities. It's a lot like hurdles. Do people criticize hurdle runners saying that "Oh wow, that 400hurdler sucks; he's only running the hurdles cause he's not fast enough to run the open 400".
Some of you guys on here never cease to amaze me.

[sprinter200]

this shouldnt be an arugment becuase....... NY owns bad

[sprinter200]

this shouldnt be an arugment becuase....... all of these athletes are sick and are at the of there respected events for example why are we talkig about brd being able to beat mike mark and 3200 and xc when mike mark is maily a half miler. lets just leave it like this New York owns

[MikeGamms]

i know of atleast2 athletes who voted for themselves...

[Canned Food]

Kelesy was runner up at the indoor state meet in the 3200, you idiot.


would u agree if murdoch was healthy hes better than kelsey in the 3200? would you agree that BRD when healthy is better than him in the 3200?

would you agree that greg kiley is better than him in a mile? would you agree that dan mcmanamon is better than him in a mile?

would you agree that john maloy is better than him in an 800? would ayou agree that aron lozier is better than him in an 800?

there ya go!

[Canned Food]

Last year, the steeple at NON for guys included two guys who were footlocker finalists that year, and two more who were finalists this year. It's obviously less than the mile or two mile, but that is still a quality field.

and they were 4:15 milers and 9:05-10 2milers. aka not gonna make a dent in the mile or 2mile.

[Canned Food]

It's a lot like hurdles. Do people criticize hurdle runners saying that "Oh wow, that 400hurdler sucks; he's only running the hurdles cause he's not fast enough to run the open 400".
Some of you guys on here never cease to amaze me.


no becuase alot of the top 400 guys do the 400IH. clement ran a WR indoors for the 400 and then ran a NCAA record in the 400IH.

[themanontherun]

would u agree if murdoch was healthy hes better than kelsey in the 3200? would you agree that BRD when healthy is better than him in the 3200?

would you agree that greg kiley is better than him in a mile? would you agree that dan mcmanamon is better than him in a mile?

would you agree that john maloy is better than him in an 800? would ayou agree that aron lozier is better than him in an 800?

there ya go!
I would agree with that, but the point is what Kelsey DID DO is qualify for states and then finish second. And your assumptions above are that those exact people will run those exact races. Kiley did not race suburbans, so he is a question mark, DMac is inconsistent, Murdock is hurt. If he didn't do steeple, Kelsey would still have a very good chance of going to states out of Section II.

[themanontherun]

and they were 4:15 milers and 9:05-10 2milers. aka not gonna make a dent in the mile or 2mile.
Last year 4:15 and 9:05 would put you 3 and 7 seconds respectively away from All-Amercan last year. That's not "making a dent" but it's not too shabby. I'm not saying the level of competition is equal, I'm just saying that it's still an event that attracts a lot of top notch runners.

[tengomiedo243]

I'm surprised Lynne Layne hasn't gotten a lot more talk on here. That girl was a two time national champion indoors last year (correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm almost positive she won SH and 55?). Outdoor was a multiple state champion. This year indoors she was a 4 or 5 (I'm not sure of the number) time All-American, while winning the 200 in a pretty deep field at NIN. On the NY leaderboard she's 3rd in the 100, leading the 200, leading the long jump, and on the 9th-ranked 4x100 that only got that time because of her incredible anchor at Loucks. Add to that the fact that she has done all of these on the few days Section 1 hasn't had a rain-covered meet, I'd say she's got the potential to be even better than she is now, and the best athlete in the state.

[runningforthegold]

Some great accomplishments as you stated for Lynn Layne but still quiite a way from national reocrds in any of the events she participates in. I still have a stong bias in favor of national record holders or the ones who may be closest to the standard in their events. Keep in mind that often the closer one gets to being the best ever in the nation the more likely they are to shed participation in so many events. A national record holder may not appear to be well rounded as some of the very high level but secondary competitiors

[purplewave at NRHS]

You say you favor national Record Holders!!! What about national Champs? Lynne Layne has won National Titles in the Hurdles, 60 Meters and the 200 meters, and that doesn't qualify as the best athlete. She has Long Jumped 19' 7 (recent winner at Penn Relays), There is only 1 national record holder on your list. You stated that normally doesn't make them the best athlete, they are just good at that event.:confused:

[runningforthegold]

I never said that being great in just one event does not make you a great athlete. Quite the opposite. I believe that the best athlete is the one who has accomplished the most. Being a national record holder means you are the very best that there has ever been in our country at the high school level. That is a very significant step up from being a national champion. When I look at Lynn's accomplishments and compare them to the national records of
11.11 100-meters
22.11 200-meters
22' 3" long jump

she is a very long way away from those marks. My bias has to go with someone who is a national record holder. I believe it takes great athletic skill to be the very best every in ANY event. I also believe that person would be able to be great in other sports as well if they dedicated their time in those areas.

[purplewave at NRHS]

Again "What are you saying" perhaps it should be what are you talking about. None of those National Records were set in the Northeast, and the thread is about our state, New York, which if you try to run anywhere fast in this weather, especially recently (at least 3 years) it's vitually impossible to reach any goals/times.:rolleyes:

[MikeGamms]

setting the national record doesnt make you the best at that event ever...it means, on one day your performance was better than any before.

to explain what i mean, heres a fake example.

the national record in the 100 is say 10.00.
runner 1 runs 9.96 once, but also runs 10.53 here, 10.31 there, and takes 5th at nationals.
runner 2 runs 10.15-10.21 multiple times. never runs faster than 10.15, but performs well when it counts and wins nationals.

in my opinion, runner 2 is the better athlete of the two, even though runner 1 is a national record holder.

(i'm not saying being national champ makes you the best athlete, becuase you might of jsut ran well a few times when it counts or whatever. im just saying that national records are not an automatic bid to being tagged "the best")

[runningforthegold]

You make some good points. Maybe being a national record holder should not automatically make you the best athlete. It is just the bias I have in making my selections

I don't think that one just kind of sneaks up and has the one great performance of a lifetime to set a national high school record. There has to be a great deal of consistancy, in the progression leading up to it.